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ladies and gentlemen we're gonna get started we're on item te 32.5 which is a 10 o'clock item 1209 12 32 1234 12 38 12 46 1250 and 1260 for college street it's a zoning amendment it's a final report it was being held for councillor by Lao councillor by Lao do you have any questions or is there anyone here to speak to the item before we get to that that side I'm 32.5 yes it is we're still holding it I'm waiting for a motion okay so that's all that's still being held okay so we are now on item still 10 o'clock 32-point 11 changing lanes city of Toronto's review of laneways Suites city initiated official plan amendment and zoning amendment final report so this is a statutory meeting and I understand that there are is a deferral motion coming however I've been asked by the clerk's office to say that if there are people here who would like to do pute in the event that they are unable to depute next month when this item comes back that they can in fact speak today at the same time there is also if there are people here who would like to speak today we have a ten minute presentation by staff on this item so I just would like to get some sense of members of the public who want to speak to changing lanes if they're still interested in speaking then please come forward if there was anyone that wanted to speak they needed to come forward what why aren't we having the presentation for well so the clerk has explained it to me but I'll allow the clerk to speak I believe the chair is just trying to determine if anyone would like to make a deputation today and if that is the case then we will have a presentation from staff and then hear those deputations is that clear yeah can we have the presentation we can that's another that's another option that I was presenting one option I was going to present a second option the second option is we can still if no one wants to speak we can still have the presentation from staff it's not I just wanted to get a sense if there was anyone in the room that wanted to speak yes people yes there are wish to speak great thank you very much so we will get a presentation from staff sorry if I just gonna check the will of the committee in light of the fact that we're still on 10 o'clock items is the 10 minutes in terms of a presentation okay colleagues 10 minutes okay great thank you I think we may have a technical issue sorry can we get some assistance from the AV Mike ready to go ready to go okay so you have ten minutes thank you good afternoon everybody thanks for having us my name is Greg EWTN's with Toronto City Planning I'm here with my colleague George pantazes for the last several months about a year we have been working on the changing lanes initiative as a report before you today that we'll talk about it I'll provide some background on our work and our recommendations first city of Toronto has a broad network of laneways 300 kilometres of lane ways within the entire city about 2,500 individual lane ways themselves you can see a map here of one of the more concentrated areas of lane ways in the city and that those are primarily within Toronto and East York District the lane waves were originally used back or they were they've been around since the city itself has been around some dating back to the 1870s originally used for utilitarian purposes sometimes stables blacksmiths later garages with the invention of the automobile lately through naming of some of these lane ways we've been able to commemorate certain historical events important people within local history which is an excellent thing it shouldn't should continue but we're to talk about housing on laneways laneways Suites specifically what is a laneway suite is a house on the same lot as another house located generally in the back yard where one of the law one of the lot lines is next to a public Lane way laneways Suites are intended to be subordinate and scale their service from the main house they're completely detached from the main house they may have outdoor access via a side yard on the lot to the street or in some cases via the lane the city is considered laneways Suites before in 2006 a review of laneway housing prompted a report from number of city staff titled housing and laneways the reports advised on permitting laneway housing it was primarily concerned with severance of new laneways houses and there were three concerns that were raised in that report the first be in compliance with the city's neighborhood policies in the then recently approved Official Plan issues regarding privacy overlooking shadowing and lack of municipal infrastructure in the lanes themselves to service the newly severed properties private entities have also studied and commented on the city's opportunity to allow for laneways Suites Bridget Shimon Donald Cheung sight-unseen Jeffery Stinson Terrence van ELLs Lander in 2003 both those documents published talked about opportunities for the city to adopt laneway housing is another form of housing in the city itself more recently a group lane scape and evergreen developed laneways Suites a new housing typology for Toronto was released in May of last year and includes among other things current legislation a summary of laneways Suites criteria and test scenarios technical comments from staff results of a consultation and approaches from other cities Council directed us in 2017 as part of that report from landscape to look at laneways Suites in Toronto in East York area to consult with city divisions and Ras and to consider an implementation strategy that looked at things such as staff resources animating laneways and affordable housing components and incremental cost increases regarding language Suites undertaking this study we were guided by generally the following principles laneways Suites are intended to be rental not severed subordinate to the principal house permitted as of right and they may not be possible on all Lots for a number of reasons so this study became what's called changing lanes changing lanes is the report that's in front of you in the report is essentially three things it recommends an official plan amendment application and a zoning bottom and an official plan amendment and a zoning bylaw amendment to permit laneways Suites subject to a range of criteria separation distance coverage height form a set of guidelines are also being developed to help assist people that would look to construct laneway Suites to communicate the in information these guidelines and zoning bylaw and talk about the process contact information city initiatives and other things that should be considered when pursuing a permit for a laneway suite I'd mentioned that the study area is confined to the the boundaries of Toronto in East York district as it existed last year so you can see that map here you can also see the laneways the majority of the city's lane ways are within Toronto in East York district so why are we considering these well provincial policies and direction supports laneways Suites the city's policies in the Official Plan intend arrange of housing in terms of form and tenure cities neighborhoods where these are primarily proposed can accommodate gradual growth and change over time that is written in the plan and laneways themselves can evolve along with this new form of housing as interesting multi-purpose public spaces but these Suites provide for a new form of housing for potentially an aging population larger families downsizing seniors people of different abilities and other groups various provincial legislation speaks to second suites and specifically laneways Suites in a number of areas the Planning Act directs that musicality shell them in their official plan have policies to allow for a second unit on a residential lot the growth plan contemplates complete communities including a mix of housing options and second Suites and the prevention policy statement contains similar wording the Official Plan which in Chapter one starts off with a number of broad statements guiding the vision of how Toronto is to grow and how the policies that come after written the Official Plan are to implement that vision it talks about a successful Toronto as being characterized by a city where housing choices are made available to all people in their communities at all stages of their lives where individuals can participate in the decisions affecting them where we meet the needs of today's generation without compromising the needs of future generations to meet theirs among many other things that characterize Toronto as a successful City the official plan also talks specifically about housing provision of a full range of housing noting that it is essential for Toronto's quality of life and that's cities balance and diversity of areas and economic success depend on the provision of a range of housing now within the Toronto and East York area there are a number of land uses that allow for growth we're looking only at the neighbourhoods designation which is generally intended to remain stable over time though not static the city's neighborhood paltin city's neighborhoods shown here in yellow contain a range of housing parks community spaces schools local businesses services and they are intended to remain stable over time though not static our recommendations in this report recommend amending the Official Plan policies in this area to permit laneways suites in neighborhoods right now laneways suites are only permitted in instances where they are consistent with the prevailing character of an area as there is no framework to allow for laneways suites they aren't characteristic of many of the city's neighborhoods we undertook a technical review in collaboration with a range of city staff looking at things such as on-street parking garbage servicing stormwater management lane maintenance things such as the separation distance setbacks green spaces outdoor access emergency access the type of Lawton main house parking sustainability tree preservation and and other things such as the opportunity for affordable rental housing levies and fees and the city's development charges this was a project that involved a range of city divisions in a collaborative effort in a which has created the report that you see before you we also consulted heavily with the community we had on the number 30th and November 29th we had some large format meetings at the original meeting we presented our objectives what we were looking at with laneway Suites but didn't provide any recommendations 250 people attended that meeting and submitted a hundred-plus comment forms that we you can see at the bottom of the screen they're tailored for the event to ensure that we received appropriate and usable feedback there was general support for what we were proposing at that meeting and the meeting we had on March 29th was attended by about as many people with some questions clarification generally support we also work closely with residents associations a number of them were very interested in this process we had an invite-only residence Association meeting on February the 24th 20-plus of the 80 or so residents associations in Toronto and East York were at that meeting and we have had several individual in group meetings with residents associations and counselors to talk about the are recommendations we've also provided periodic updates to all of the residents associations whether they engage with us or not as well as counselors offices throughout the study process at key times I won't go into details on the criteria the report does that thoroughly though this is what is being proposed in the zoning bylaw amendment it's essentially a two-story maximum height laneway house which is separated from the main house by either five or seven and a half meters if you have a one or two storey laneway house respectively there is an angular plane transition from or a step back rather I have the second-story to assist with overlook and privacy issues there are landscaped open space requirements on the laneway side second floor amenity areas are only permitted facing the lane itself there are no balconies permitted facing into the Lots there is a setback from the lane as well which is a greater setback than is currently required in the zoning bylaw for garages that has to provide for greening and an entry space and a front door in some cases to these laneway houses the emergency access requirements for these laneway suites can be a constraint there are a few ways to provide emergency access to laneways Suites they're detailed in the report but they result in a number of lots specifically on areas with large unbroken lanes in areas with smaller side yards as being not able to achieve the criteria for adequate emergency access the lanes themselves present enormous opportunities as public spaces and along with the creation of housing on these lanes the city will monitor developments and determine where improvements may be made where maintenance required additional maintenance is required and part of requiring increase setbacks and for the lanes themselves is to provide for landscaping and lighting on private property next to the lane severance azar a concern that we share with the communities the policies is owning by law the guidelines and the development charge framework all deter people from severing their properties there may be very unique instances in which severance azar possible those would have to be considered via the zone bylaw amendments and a full set of development charges will be paid upon severance so there are significant financial process and policy barriers the severance is occurring we are recommending a three year monitoring period where we will monitor everything to do with the implementation of this that will include staff training as well to ensure consistent approach in the application of laneways Suites so the recommending these to be permitted in the zoning bylaw as of right so if you could achieve if you could build a laneway suite on your property which met the azov rights owning you would require a building permit potentially other permits but generally a building permits there are in some cases variances may be considered and the city will consider those against the four tests as we usually would but we also wanted to note that buildings which achieve accessible design standards sustainable building technology protect mature trees and accommodate a laneway suite within an existing building should be given consideration we were asked to look at laneway Suites as part of the affordable housing strategy the Ontario's long term affordable strategy recognizes second units as a potential source of affordable rental housing to allow homeowners to earn more additional income and exempting second units from such as laneway Suites of basement apartments from DC's makes them less costly to build resulting in more units in an area where there is an S and assess 'ti to provide a different form of rental housing staff are recommending a pilot program with financial incentives that will result in rents being maintained at affordable levels over a period of time on certain laneways suites that would be an application process in a way similar to open door so in summary the report presents an official plan amendment and zoning bylaw amendment which provides certain criteria to govern the development of laneways Suites where appropriate in the Toronto and East York area a set of guidelines would be forthcoming depending on receipt of the recommendations and any changes and those are intended to clarify the guidelines the Official Plan amendments and assist those looking to build or modify an existing structure to create housing unit in conclusion laneways suites are consistent with provincial policy legislation city policies they have been successfully implemented in many other cities it will limit they've been designed to limit their impact on adjacent properties they can introduce a new form of rental accommodation provide opportunities for populations young families different family structures to live within neighborhoods that can accommodate appropriate infill and change over time these are subject to ongoing analysis and a reduced application fee and streamlined approach to ensure that they will be constructed where appropriate they can also improve the enhance the safety of our land waves providing more eyes on these spaces and better lighting laneways Suites represent good planning I want to quickly thank couple of my colleagues in numerous divisions who collaborated on this specifically my colleague George satara caroline deanna jeremy joseph thank you Tulane sleep and evergreen and thank you to all of the residents associations who took time to meet with us attend our meetings and engage in constructive conversations that help shaped and inform this initiative in a significant way I'd be happy to answer any questions thank you thank you very much for your presentation I have no doubt that that represents they bought a very large body of work and and and it's a summary of the consultations from from the Republican gaygent meetings at this point in time I'm going there's no questions of staff right now we're going to move straight to deputies you've all been extremely patient you have this is a 10:00 a.m. item which is now being heard at 2:00 p.m. so hope you've had a chance to get your coffee and lunch we're gonna buckle you in we're ready for deputations so there are a number of Deputies I'm going to call you yeah great presentation I don't know if we have that presentation we don't have it we don't have a copy here yet so you didn't have a coffee for councillors councillor Fletcher would you like a copy now normally we would have a coffee okay so we're working from that so so please note that the councillor Fletcher has requested that it can't be of today's staff presentation be made available now for the members of the committee so if we can just ask that to to get that printed off and circulated okay wonderful so councillor you're gonna get your present your presentation in a hardcopy soon our first speaker registered to speak and before you come up just to go through the rules one more time for those who are registered to speak today you were very welcome to speak there is a referral motion with some instructions from counselors coming forward just taking a look at what I believe is going to be a series of lengthy recommendations that are going to a staff to do additional work in review it is most likely going to come back with some supplementary attachments to it which means that if you speak today contrary to my earlier instructions you will most likely still have the opportunity to speak when it comes back at this matter in June so you get two shots out of it so like to call our first speaker George Emerson and then just to get yourself ready Nikolas coach ance Chen Kanchan II you are next please George you will have five minutes just note that Ben this committee we do not curb your speaking time we want you to get everything you need to say said and the clock is on your left hand side I'll start it when you're ready Thank You counselors thank you city staff hello my fellow truant onehans on this beautiful warm day my name is George Emerson my family of six soon to be seven live on galley Avenue in Parkdale and I want to give you some personal some social and some economic context as you deliberate this important opportunity in city building so I came to Parkdale as an economic refugee from the Maritimes when in the 80s unemployment was around 20% my wife came 50 years ago as an economic refugee from Jamaica my father in law says Parkdale was once nothing but Maritimers and west indians and all these people coming to Parkdale renting a little room getting a good job if they're lucky a house that's what builds Toronto in little neighborhoods like Parkdale and all over the city my father-in-law a victim Mullings was the first black driver for the TTC his friend Larry McCleary was the first black police officer in the City of Toronto my mother-in-law dear Daphne was one of the first black nurses at SickKids I'll get back to Grandma in a second because her story is a bearing on laneways sweets but that's the personal context how I come to be here living and thriving in Toronto and very thankful for the city that I'm in I'm also a member of the executive of the ronsis fales MacDonell residents association which is one of the oldest continuously operating residents associations in Toronto a majority of the executive of the our marae is in favor of laneway sweets but as a residents Association we are not taking a stance one way or another I think and some of us feel that there's something not quite right about Ras trying to claim to have a representative constituency when we already have one and that's you the City Council who have done a great service in engaging the city staff to examine this issue very thoroughly to listen to a lot of people and to make some well-thought-out recommendations but for what it's worth the our marae did a little survey this week and there was overwhelming interest in laneway sweets amongst our our membership who have responded to our little email survey I'm personally in favor of laneway sweets because it's an organic way to add capacity to a city to grow a city and if the reports are correct we have a dire crisis and housing availability and we have a cityscape that's quite underdeveloped when I first moved to the old city Toronto from the old city of Halifax I couldn't believe how underdeveloped the the old city of Toronto was the downtown old neighborhoods compared to even an old city like Halifax like just the way the houses are built it's serious under utilization of land now I say my family on galleys going to seven not because we're having another baby but because we're moving in my mother-in-law Daphne we don't want her isolated and living on her own as she enters her 90s and I would far prefer to accommodate grandma with a nice ground-level accessible laneway suite rather than have to undergo major renovations to 3/4 stories depending on the size of house you having down Toronto or two-story whatever these are old buildings that can be adapted but there's a lot of investment required especially if you're dealing with things like accessibility and ground-floor access so lamely suite is a perfect opportunity for Grandma and grandma would actually like it she wants to be close to her family she doesn't move in with them and I know a lot of grandmas feel the same way and a lot of daughters and their son in-laws feel the same way so a laneway suite could not only be used for Grandma but in years to come it could be a place for the young men in our family coming back from university to get a start in their own place or we can rent it out on the market to help defray the costs of homeownership and living the city the cost of education and so on and I know what great many of my neighbors are also in this kind of a transition phase of life the empty nest phase they're anticipating and I know many of them who said they want to build a laneway suite not necessarily for Grandma they want to move into it they want to rent out the big house in the front these three four five bedroom houses that I think are frankly seriously underutilized in the City of Toronto and now here there is a very serious shortage of family rental family size rental accommodations in the City of Toronto and this is a way that you with a simple vote can really increase the capacity of that type of rental housing whether it's in the back or the front you're adding capacity that is seriously underutilized at this point that's it thanks very much as Corbusier said the house is a machine for living you have an opportunity with a simple vote to make it a much more powerful tool great thank you very much George thank you are there any members with questions for the speaker seeing none thank you George thank you Nicolas cause Cheney coach Hanny I'm sorry I'm gonna get her write it you'll get it one day councillor this is I hang my head in shame please no so good afternoon members of Community Council thank you for having me here today my name is nicholas ghosh annie and i am coach annie and i am an urban planner at the laneway project we are a non-profit planning and design consultancy working here in Toronto to create laneway demonstration projects encourage laneway friendly policies and procedures such as the ones before you today and to inspire empower and support communities in undertaking their own language projects so the motion that you have before you today really sets the stage for increased language revitalization within the City of Toronto while providing very specific requirements for what constitutes appropriate developments that fit right in a laneway and while we would like to see the ability to build laneway streets extended to the entire city at one point not just within the Toronto and East York district we accept the proposed policy in its current form and would like to see it passed today rather than deferred further down the line because the sooner we can start building these laneway streets providing our revitalizing our laneways the better in our opinion cities around the world have taken steps to live in their Lane waves these include cinema cities not just different from Toronto but similar to Toronto including Melbourne Chicago Baltimore Portland Vancouver San Francisco Seattle the list goes on those are only the cities that have laneway housing projects but there are a variety of other cities such as Virginia and Ottawa which also have which also have other accessory dwelling units such as backyard Suites this is just one tool to revitalize early noise but a very important one the motion is a step towards bringing our laneways into life transforming them from neglected spaces into calm community gathering points or vibrant spaces or simply places of nature and to finally end on a humorous note the motion will also allow Millennials like myself to move out of our parents basements and into their garages so thank you very much for having me and we hope that you do pass this motion today thank you thank you very much Nick was coal Shanee Oh shiny thank you any questions for Nikolas okay councillor Davis followed by councillor by Lao of course I wondered about where there are late where there's Lane away housing in other jurisdictions are there limits on those that back on to busy commercial lane ways that are the back of like the blurred a North where there is potentially real conflicting use loading and large trucks and that kind of activity so I know off the top of my head in Vancouver where they have some language which are commercial on one side and residential on the other and that similar to some lane ways here in the city such as those around like Danforth East like Den I think Greenwood I believe they allowed laneway housing on the residential side obviously not on the commercial side however right but they they they haven't experienced the conflict between those used oh no not to my knowledge the lane way is acts as kind of a unifying space if you will because they managed to calm these spaces down so that while there is still commercial unloading the space still acts as a it's still calm enough that it doesn't conflict with the residential uses on the other side of the language that makes sense okay thank you thank you Thank You councillor Barlow questions in your opinion would a project like this have an impact on the safety of our laneways or yes I absolutely I do believe it would because when you add things like Lane away streets to lane ways you provide aisel Mullane way you provide a more active engaged population laneways currently our scene has engaged sorry of non gauged neglected spaces and I think that's largely due to the fact that we don't have people who are literally facing onto them too often our lane is blocked by fences or the backs of garages for instance but if you have people whose front doors and on to a laneway for sure they're going to start caring more about the space and moreover that provides more sort of political capital to do further revitalizations on these lands and provide other such interventions that would also provide for public safety okay thank you very much anyone else with questions okay thank you thank you very much thank you our next speaker is Craig Reis following Craig would be Mike Olaf Renner I'm going to be combining with Joe flat from Evergreen for my talk okay wonderful go ahead please okay thank you good afternoon really pleased to be here to be looking at this really innovative work coming out of the city my name is Joe flat I'm senior manager policy and partnerships at evergreen were a national nonprofit organization with a mandate to create flourishing cities all across the country we work with senior decision-makers such as yourselves and the general public to work together in creating these amazing cities of the future I've had the privilege over the past two years to do a lot of this work in partnership with landscape and to councillors Anabella and Mary Margaret McMahon and we are really committed to seeing this through and think it's an amazing opportunity for this city why do we think it's an amazing opportunity because we know we have a bit of a challenge when it comes to housing affordability and rental supply and to address this challenge we need 21st century solutions that are innovative that are different that are unique to actually address this problem and we can't just have one solution we need many and this presents one really valuable option for Toronto to think about increasing its density in a gentle way and how do we know this is worth pursuing so we've heard from many many community residents and stakeholders across the city that this is something that they want to see through our consultations in-person survey correspondents walking tours bike tours we've done many many things with many different people and we've heard over and over and over again the you want to see laneway sweets in their communities because they want to live in dense walkable complete neighborhoods they don't have places to go they can't afford to buy a house so they would like to live with their parents and their separate dwelling and they see this as a real opportunity to move forward on and a real opportunity for the city so what do Torontonians want they want new housing solutions they want to live in great places and they want their municipal leaders to be bold and to take on new approaches to dealing with the problems that we have in our city thank you thanks Joe and thank you for hearing us study councillors it's important to reinforce the laneway housing is not a new solution as you've heard before cities like Saskatoon and Regina are far more advanced in Toronto in terms of their housing when it comes to living on laneways impressive that they've lapped us Vancouver is the originator of this and they've had a policy in place for over 10 years now currently there's a provincial mandate from the ministry of housing for all municipalities in Ontario to create official plan changes and zoning bylaw amendments to accommodate detached laneway Suites that's why Ottawa did it in 2016 and have seen success in their municipality our fellow citizens are desperate for more flexibility when it comes to housing 91% of our survey respondents online said that they want to see this in your wards and today you've got 175 letters supporting this in front of you and three that are maybe not objecting but have some valid input on how it could be improved but they're far away by people who are saying this needs to happen now and they're actually asking for higher density and higher Heights and things that we don't think they should have but they want to see more so it sounds like we're doing the right thing it's important to also understand that we need to change the way we think about living on laneways in Toronto we're not talking about the laneway mansions you're probably familiar with that are three storeys and generally bad urbanism we're talking about laneway Suites the important distinction is that they are non severable and that's been assured by the recent changes to the development charges by law if you try to suffer them you have to pay very steep development charges so there is financial penalty if you try to do that already in place the height maximum of 6 meters ensures that the laneway suite will always be subordinate even to one-story houses with peach roofs the maximum footprint means their space to accommodate cars if the homeowner chooses or have family oriented units the rear yard angular plane ensures that the shadow impact of these will have a barely different impact than current as of right garages on neighbors and make sure that there's very minimal overlook and privacy concerns something I found in the laneway houses I've designed for clients is that they want people looking into their languages as little as they want to look into your house so good design will follow from this policy finally they're going to improve our laneways they're going to create Beauty and Safety and ensure that we're activating this underutilized portion of our city with high quality street facades basement apartments and other secondary units are great but they still don't instill a sense of housing pride that our changing demographics need I don't feel proud putting my grandmother or my kids in a basement apartment I want them to have accessible housing options they're above grade that are bright that are airy and I want to support my loved ones in dwellings that they can be proud of and I want families to be able to rent in low-rise neighborhoods where there are schools and parks because right now they can't afford to buy I build leymah houses here in Toronto and I've toured them all over North America and I have to applaud the city for these suggested guidelines they listen to Torontonians and they address their sensitivities in a very thorough and comprehensive way they offer an implementation strategy that's controlled focused and is able to adapt as time goes on and we learn from the early adopters finally they've been respectful to our official plan to all secondary plans and heritage districts not to mention our tree canopy this is really good policy work and supporting this sends a message that we want to empower our homeowners who have roots in our neighborhoods this is a vision that collectively that is collectively authored by the people who live in your wards they need their kids to transition out of their home during college then he didn't come to afford their mortgages they need to support their family members in a suite that their family members can be proud to live in and this policy gives them the power to do that you should support it in its entirety and the thousands of Torontonians who have put in work to make this happen want to see our city grow in a positive way I know that you do too thank you very much thank you very much to you both are there any questions councillor the havok first you very much I really appreciate what you said um and I just by what contest I do support I do have some questions around frankly affordability Joe you mentioned affordability do you have any data say let's start with this say Vancouver or Regina or the other cities ever mentioned how many folks actually rent out versus how many folks for how many folks is this a granny flat or a secondary unit do you have any data on that so this is anecdotal but from a site visit in Vancouver last year a lot of Elaine way sweets are you being used for intergenerational living so we can't claim that laneways sweets are going to solve our affordable housing challenges but it is going to contribute to the stock of our get that so would you say twenty percent eighty twenty percent become rented and about eighty percent fifty sixty we don't have any data you don't have any data on that okay I'll ask top the same same question later on so okay so now let's separate the ones for whom it is intergenerational or extended family or partnership living they go over here that's all fine and good now we're only focused on the ones that are rented mm-hmm how would you assure affordability do you think there's enough here to assure affordability in a market driven rental economy it's whatever the market can bear I have a question to ask you so I I have a question I'm wondering if laneways sweets are where we need to be focusing that specific question so I think there's lots of tools as as I mentioned to address this problem of affordability and maybe laneways sweets aren't where we're gonna be getting the the most affordability because it's actually hard to build them affordably it's very expensive we know it's expensive to build in the City of Toronto so unless there's incentives that may be coming from the city I can imagine that it would be hard to make them all affordable so minimally just to push you a little bit you shouldn't be talking about affordability when you're talking about Langley housing unless we put in place a series of policy folks clarify I say that our housing challenges around affordability I did not claim as that laneways Suites we're going to address challenges of affordability okay thank you although they will okay thank you very much counselor counselor McMahon question and they you next thank you very much what do you think do you think we should make a decision today or we should defer this make a decision we've been working on this for three years with councillors with city staff with literally thousands of Torontonians they've waited long enough and this needs to happen now it's flexible enough that it can change and grow with our city it needs to happen now and the last time it was visited at City Hall was two years ago 2006 right so this is the closest we've we've were we beamed to adopting a laneway politic so its Suites policy yeah and that policy was fundamentally flawed it implied that services would have to be run through the laneway we've addressed that simply by focusing on the severability issue and making it financially impossible for people to sever laneway houses now the servicing is already resolved like it already is for any kind of secondary suite within a house and you feel that you're the community consultation you've been involved with right across the city has been extensive or we feel that you've reached thousands of thousands of people from wards all over this city and we have heard unanimous that again I think we may need to redefine how we understand this this is a missing middle part of the housing ecosystem we are not going to be providing deeply affordable units through this strategy but this is for that middle section which we know are really really struggling to live in by in our communities we won't have teachers living in the city if we don't come up with new solutions to laneway housing or to starting to housing generally that's the that's the basic thing here this is one drop in the bucket really in the grand scheme of tools that we need to be moving forward on and how we can think innovatively around solutions I think it's important to note 2600 Torontonians answered our online survey we had about 400 people show up to community consultations and the city's had another 400 you've had over 400 letters mailed to your offices in support of this there's no shortage of people who have been engaged in this process and have helped create it thank you okay thank you very much for your question councillor fragile deck is fuck-all followed by councillor Davis any other members please indicate your your desire to speak with your hand thanks madam thanks madam chair and so you said this is zero to do with affordability I'm wondering how much supply do you think you're going to add to the housing crisis that we're facing in the Toronto and East York district given the nature of the city and the district that we live in and not all the parts of the district actually have laneways so how many units do you think this endeavor will create the City of Vancouver approves about a hundred building permits every year and we think we'd be a little bit higher than that the city's estimated between I think one and three hundred units a year sorry you're saying that you think you're going to create a hundred units a year that's what Vancouver is doing and we expect to potentially outpace that okay so and you think a hundred units a year is going to do you think that that's going to solve the supply issue for housing in this city categorical yes no it's not it's flexibility for okay thank you very much no way it's part of many many things that we need to be doing but why would we not move ahead on something that's gonna give us a hundred more units thank you very much for those answers councillor Davis thank you I wanted to ask the same question about councillors can I ask you to keep your debate on the side to a very quiet level so I don't have to hear it if I want to hear I want to hear the deputies please and I want to hear the questions from the members please go ahead about crowded service type laneways where these businesses are doing loading and whether or not that's appropriate we we know that commercial industrial or employment lands juxtaposed to residential areas often caused conflict and in this situation you're face to face and whether or not that would present any particular issues that you've identified right so for the for the laneway suite itself garbage would be collected where it currently is which is typically on the Main Street in front of the house so we wouldn't be adding any sort of garbage or servicing requirements to the laneway unless it already exists there and in our studies very few of the properties where this would apply have an aura zone property adjacent to a commercial or employment land property across a laneway there are certainly conditions where that happens and right now people's houses back onto them so we don't see it causing any adverse effects I think it's impulse also important to note that this is an incremental strategy I feel like we have can have a lot of confidence in staff to that and the slowness of how these houses get built to iterate into adjust in situations that maybe aren't perfect so those kinds of questions could be sort of developed over time so the other issue is guidelines and we're currently waiting for guidelines so there's a piece of me thinks why wouldn't we wait till he had guidelines and I understand we're also doing second suite a secondary suite review under the Opie somehow I think those things should all fit together wouldn't that make sense guidelines for laneway Suites along with the Opie amendments for secondary Suites no I'm gonna ask tab that okay and so we we have seen the draft guidelines for the laneway Suites and we've read the bylaws that are attached to this and in general they look really good and they've done a good job of addressing the sensitivities that were provided to us by Torontonians during our engagement process thank you very much our next speaker there are no more questions question often we hear about permit parking here you may have been here this morning when you heard the gentleman talking about the developments and permit parking have you given some consideration to what should happen or your suggestions about a permit at each of those laneway homes that's something that they've tackled or you've thought about at all you mean like street parking permissions for I'm not sure I'm not sure what the final decision on that was there was talk of limiting street permit parking for people who build laneways Suites that's fine by us thank you thank you very much councillor Fletcher any other members with questions for the speaker okay seeing none thank you to both our speakers I'd like to call Mike Olaf render Michael welcome you will have five minutes thank you I'm Michael friend err I'm architect on the city we've built a few we've renovated some Leah noise Suites we built new ones and we just finished a brand new coach house and in the annex and so we're pretty familiar with a lot of the challenges of servicing building permitting committee development charges and on and on as they go so I just wanna say I'm very excited to see this before you guys today and I really hope we vote for it I mean approve it and we move on and we keep extending opportunities for other lot types in the city as well right I mean secondary Suites shouldn't necessarily be limited to a lot that has a lane we have if we have a big city that can take advantage every us one of one thing I noticed is for instance a through lot is not covered in this so there are some houses where they the garage you'll see will front on a street well currently in this zoning that doesn't have the permission to have a laneway suite on that lot the law says it has to have a lane which is totally fine but I would say this is step number one we passed it we know we got to keep moving ahead I attended the meeting with Richard shim and dawn Chong over 15 years ago and they did that changing lanes book that was referenced there and so it's been a long time coming looking at all of these these options so you know I think deferring doesn't feel right to me it feels like we should vote and and and move on and free up other types of properties and other types of opportunities to build additional intensification on the city it's happening all around us so allowing it to happen at this scale of property just seems like a long time coming so I don't have any more to say on that but I'm happy to answer any questions if yes thank you very much Michael for your remarks councillor crusty followed by councillor McMahon that would be councillor Layton I know sorry we looked the same I'm just gonna get some free professional advice what's the cost per square foot to build a laneway house everyone gets their pads and paper just to try to I mean I'll try and weasel out of as much as I can come on not gonna be cheap is it's gonna be difficult because you're gonna have to build the foundation and figure out if we're doing basements and there's a lot of program people want to put in these languages which we've had a lot of people since this initiative has started they've been coming to us because everyone has that need and it's always a specific need so someone has a grandmother and some of them are gonna be nanny sweets some people want to put parking garage we've got one client who's looking at putting a car elevator so you can put a second elevator in the basement so they can free up the space for that for the laneway suite so in some instances it's going to be you know $200 a square foot and some maybe 400 and how much in your experience or with this last example how much does the the cost of the DC the going to the committee like what does that represent in an actual cost well on the project we've done in Admiral which is probably the the last new koto system built I'm a virgin lop and didn't have a historic coach house the development charges were almost a hundred thousand and the approach was they met with one of the lawyers here and they said you know there's and pay the fee get the permits then appeal it and we'll see what happens later on so it's a because they they knew that development charges were artificially high because you have to you have to essentially value the lot it was a long process but in this case I believe there's an exception for development charges immunity adjustment process is another project because right now you know if someone comes into our office with a regular project they're looking at nine months until they get their permit in the best case scenario knowing that ninety-five percent of our projects have some element that's not going to comply with the bylaw and I would say this probably similar things are going to come up with these you know it's impossible to make a perfect violin right every Lots different every user is going to be different so we passed this we keep moving and some language suites are gonna have to go for a special zoning variances okay thank you councillor McMahon thank you very much so you're saying that this in your mind this would be today's policy would be phase one and that phase two we should look at other types of secondary Suites so late garages backing on to our face fronting onto an arterial road driveways with a garage at the end absolutely yes we need phase 2 phase 3 this is not enough well there's a limitation in the bylaw to having two houses on a loss and every time we've had a historic property there's a lot of historic properties that have two houses on a lot and so when someone comes in and they say they come to our office and say we have a house on we have two houses on a lot we're like jackpot we can we can work with that now right and so the first thing is knocking down this barrier that says that the only other suite can be in the basement and once you've knocked that barrier down for instance we've done accessory structures you can have an accessory structure where you can have a in other parts of the city in North York and whatnot you want to have a gym in your backyard if you have a certain type of classification you can have that gym but no one can sleep in the gym god forbid someone sleeps in the gym right so I think it's phase one of a living document and living process and you and you'd like to see it passed today absolutely thank you thank you very much for your remarks I'd like to call Sitaram kala Wan Singh and following Sita will be Jennifer hunter Sita welcome back thank you you have five minutes good afternoon everybody I'd like to make it clear that I do support the concept of laneways suites but the devil is in the details and today for example we received for the very first time a copy of revised amendments to the zoning bylaw and if you look for example if you have it at the section 1 5 0.8 point 20.1 general the first point which talks about laneways suite permitted uses it says despite regulation blah blah blah the laneway suite may be used for living accommodation if this is supposed to provide housing why does not it's safe will or shall as opposed to may so there are many prop there as I said we've only seen this for the first time today this is an amendment and if there's any reason for deferring one round to get all of these things right I think that should happen so the question around deferral is not about we don't support or we don't like or we don't want it has to do with some problems that are in there's the way in which it has been drafted there are recommendations in the communications from Harvard Village from ABC residents association from Seton Village which provides some significant detail which I think you need to really take a look at and tightened up so when it comes back in June there's absolutely no difficulty in moving this forward because you know my motto is more haste less speed if you move this forward the way it is you're gonna wind up in a situation where people are unhappy and we'll do the appeal process and it might be another year or two before we actually get to implementation so I'm urging you to take the months to get this right my second point since some specific details are for example weeds witness in the Grange neighborhood I'm in from The Grange Community Association where people have been using committee for just meant to get around a zoning bylaw in this particular instance the way in which I read this amendment to the zoning bylaw there is no the floorspace calculation is not included it provides as of right 0.3 times area of the lot so where does that actually get us in terms of the density and maximum density and will that not contribute to destabilization of stable neighborhoods so I think that there's needs to be some tightening up over the floor space and the Forex and so that needs to be done there is some comment about monitoring and I think that the monitoring needs to happen sooner than three years because we want to know how many are being built we want to know as well in addition to how many being built we know what the impact is s-mint will be and I know that may not happen until 2020 but we don't want to be in a situation where we actually want to understand what's actually going on I don't really have anything further to say I mean I'm intend to be back here in June to actually comment on the corrections that are made my cover letter outlines the whole bunch of issues that I think need to be need to be principles which govern this thank you very much thank you very much don't go anywhere you have questions from Council Erma Havok yes thank you very much for coming and presenting um so one of one of the issues that you've identified is density calculations so right now it's an accessory unit it's not counted in the density calculation for a community of adjustment purposes I'll just finish the question and if you do it so let's say you add on I don't know whatever it is I say 300 say 500 square feet and into the back onto your garage you're saying that if later on the house wants to put on a third floor that that size that garage might need to be calculated in the density consideration for them putting on a third floor I mean of the main house or the main house yeah we run into situations like this before where because of definitions of girls floor area and so on people have actually been granted approvals which are way in excess of the permitted density so the way in which I'm reading some of this and it seems to me that increasingly zoning and density has no meaning in the planning regime in the city I'm a little bit concerned about Dutch any other big areas like big things that strike you as an experienced um person that we need to look at I'm really concerned about the destabilization of neighborhoods and the other comment I would make is that even though this is only limited to streets which are residential lanes are I think that there are examples where there is commercial and residential on the other side there's one that I know of in my neighborhood which is coming forward and I think it's entirely appropriate to take a look at some commercial strips maybe not as part of this exercise but in some other some other exercise but you know I would really urge a detailed review of the recommendations from sacred village from ABC residents and contrary to what somebody said earlier about residents associations not having any place in this debate I disagree with that because we do have ongoing detailed conversations all the time with members of our association and they actually count upon us to feed that and bring it forward thank you very much Sita your next set of questions is coming from councillor Davis followed by councillor McMahon yeah and I will ask this of staff you didn't comment on it but no sir can I speak into your mic or ii-if if these are as of right buildings we may see the loss of more trees or at least I worry about what the impact will be on trees I wonder if you've looked at that oh well I know that the other residents groups have looked at it in great detail and the kind of minimum distances from the main house building and so on actually I think creates stress upon the amount of green space that would be available and in downtown neighborhoods such as the one that I live in which we are under there's limited amount of green space and so on and so forth you don't want to have every single little bit of back yard even if it's you know half of it you you want to make sure there's sufficient space green space for trees for drainage and so on and so forth yes and I should have mentioned green issues mm-hmm it's right now as of right trees disappear all the time during redevelopment right as of right developments they it Trump's our tree by law so I mean I know many this will be mostly on existing garages but it may not be there may be a whole bunch of new ones that where trees exist and if it's as of right we could lose what few trees we have when part of the draft a zoning bylaw I was looking at has some examples of the percentage levels you know 25 percent to 85 percent a bit demo anyway I think that needs to be refined a little bit okay Thank You counsel thank you very much counselor counselor McMahon questions thank you very much so see the yurt thanks for coming down your residence Association has some concerns as you said and a couple other ones and have you heard and read about the other residents associations who don't have concerns and they think this is fantastic and we should get on with it yeah yeah I heard that but there are other residents associations who have done extensive reviews in greater detail and I would suggest perhaps maybe in greater deal because everybody part of what I think the submission I've heard from everybody so far is that there are a lot of people who support this so they support it but I don't know to what extent they've actually taken the time to look through you know the details and the implementation and that's why we've taken the time to do it because we live in a very dance downtown neighborhood because we want to make this work and I think it needs to work but it cannot be you know have moved forward in a way that you know undermines neighborhoods and and did you voice that when you came out to some of the community consultations I went to two of them and I have had several email exchanges with the planner he's fully aware of our concerns so you you feel that you want to take a month and get it right and then you have other groups landscape and evergreen and and planners at the city who feel that they have gotten it right with this and then you have other groups like earn residents is you heard the deputy before you who said this is this should be this is just scratching the surface it should be phase one and we need you face two and three and so do you not think that there's a balance somewhere in the middle there there lies the sweet spot is your experience here when you you know that if you're not pleasing if everyone is not pleased then you found the sweet spot that may well be so but I do believe that there are problems that were in the zoning bylaw didn't need to be fixed for you to achieve what it is you want to achieve councillor yeah I mean there's a balance yes and thank you okay thank you very much councillor McMahon councillor by Lao please questions thank you thank you see that you did say that do you have participated in the consultation so you recognise that there has been an effort from city staff to meet with the residents associations and and actually work with some of the residents associations that themselves have done quite a bit of work on this correct so is it would it be possible to do this work between now and Council as well that there's a recommendation that we actually instead of deferring it that we actually just ask staff to between the now and counsel in three weeks that we continue that work that you've been doing and so many resident associations have been doing with our staff and that we acknowledge I acknowledge as well that the right has that the work has to be done right but acknowledging that there's been a lot of work being put into it and continue that work until Council it's not the first time we've done that we do that all the time would that be acceptable well we as residents don't have the opportunity first of all to address council we will not have the opportunity of their revisions to the Official Plan amendment or the job zoning of bylaw to comment on it except by a way of communications you know as I said fairly early on more haste less speed so I'd like to take the time to get it right so you're just you're basically message is that this is moving too fast no I don't think it's moving too fast I'm I don't think that a month will jeopardize this but moving it in three weeks would if you don't have it right you run the risk of Appeals which takes you a year out or two years out am I done yes thank you very much you did very well that was a lot of questions for you Jennifer hunter I'd like to on a very quick point I'm sorry before I call the next speaker on a point of personal privilege I'd like to recognize councillor Layton so in an effort to speed up some of the proceedings later in the in the meeting if there are members of the public for here on items te 32.3 one thirty two point three two thirty two point three three and thirty two point three four these are all for your information patios in Ward 19 on College Street if you are if you could just meet me at that back door I'm gonna try to save your time and this committees thank you thank you very much counselor that is a very efficient okay so I'd like to call Jennifer hunter after Jennifer will be Karen Gore's line welcome Jennifer thanks okay so you'll have five minutes the clock is on your left hand side I I just want to make absolutely clear that if I depute today I will have another chance if in fact we do come back in in a month that's I'll just stop the clock yes you will have another chance there's a very good chance that this item is going to have to come back with a series of supplementary reports okay I'm taking a guess into the future I don't know for certain my I think smart money would be yes okay does that make sense if I was a betting woman I'm not a gambler myself I'll start your clock now okay may I approach and pass if you can hand it to our clerk staff we will have be happy to distribute that for you okay not a problem this group can share when you're ready five minutes thanks um thanks for having us me I'm Jennifer hunter I'm the chair of the Seton Village residents Association I do apologize because I had a family that was that was here this morning who had to leave and they they live behind a laneway house in our neighborhood that that has some some problematic issues so I'm gonna slightly shift what I'm gonna say just to to kind of reflect some of the things that they've said to me and we've dealt with so Seton village is a neighborhood in Ward 24 now bound by bluer bluer Bathurst DuPont and Christie streets there are 45 lanes in Seton Village and approximately 40 existing ancillary buildings ranging in height from one to two stories and with varying depths and other conditions on those laneways some are currently used as non-conforming residential Suites while others are work studios I'm not going to tell you who they are because I don't want to get them in trouble artists lofts storage and or other types of live work commercial spaces at least two of these structures were former stables and housed horses on the main floor and hay and supplies on the second so in our neighborhood lot size vary but the average hovers around this 16 to 90-foot range and like the rest of Toronto home types of very so some of the the anomalies in the neighborhood water lots at once contain abattoirs out of mechanic shops bakeries and other commercial ventures but a few of those have been converted into live workspaces off the lane ways and in your package you'll you'll see one at two of those and and they actually work really successfully as Lane way home but there you in the package they're the two they're really similar they're brick two-story kind of nicely set back off the side so what I have to say is that best known for his services White House chief of staff to President Richard Nixon and for his role and events leading to the Watergate burglaries in the Watergate scandal or H Haldeman famously said you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube the s Vieira believes Toronto can and should benefit from other cities like Vancouver's process including their process challenges and revisions I want to be very clear that we do support laneway housing absolutely we do like Sita said we want to get this right the first time we also know far too much neighborhood planning already happens at the committee of adjustment in the OMB and nail T lab we have repeatedly experienced how this process pits neighbors against one another and how results this results in the erosion of relationships within the neighborhood many of our concerns with this final report have to do with the room left for interpretations the permissions in these recommended policies allow so briefly and without refinement our specific concerns include the as of right permissions we think the streamlined processes is great but there are some good and problematic aspects to this we believe existing buildings sorry that existing buildings will be exempt and can simply be approved regardless of their size massing gfa and FSI we believe the density of the ad the accessory dwelling should be included not excluded wiebel also believe that Neff gfa what happens you'll see in the package one of the last the last pieces in the package is a house that was was significantly developed in our neighborhood so what's gonna happen with over development of the main building or the house like what if it's already over developed and how is that measured or considered when when somebody goes on that lot to create a laneway dwelling are there controls for limiting the amount of development in the main house with a laneway suite and please note this is not about density it's about massing loss of green space the tree canopy shadowing and privacy concerns we also believe basement Suites ought to be included in the G FA of the main building there are as you'll see in our package there's a house I didn't I didn't for privacy reasons list any of the addresses but there's one at the beginning of the package that has I don't have it you do so it's it's at the beginning it's it's a it's a really great-looking laneway house or you're gonna be out of time very soon just general want to put that if you want to put the image on to the screen we'll just amplify that and just have the image looking look at the image as if it was directly in front of you there you go okay and I'll just give you 30 seconds to finish your remarks I can do that so what we see in this backyard you know as as councillor Davis pointed out one of the things that we're really concerned with is how certain encroach they're going to affect the backyard and in this backyard we have astroturf basement stairs stairs leading up to the Suites of the main building so so agreeing with Sita Ram Cala Wan Singh and other residents associations we're not saying no we're asking to really really consider the details okay thank you very much are there questions for the speaker councillor Davis go ahead it's time to understand so your position is the G FA should include a second suite we think that the G FA of the accessory dwelling of the the suite ought to be ought to be considered like it should it should be it the as of right permissions without the gf8 could be problematic depending on the size of the lot and and those and some of the where we think we see the loopholes is is with some of the setbacks can you show us some of the other pictures that you were using to make whatever points these your microphone on yes my microphone is on thank you sure I know you you did a lot of work to prepare these and they're not they weren't seeing that look at the image facing you perfect thank you privacy the height is not really a concern the setbacks from the side are pretty great there's there's actually access to the rear yard I didn't take it from the the laneway I apologize but I did this is the house the backyard and you can see how in this instance the conditions are our very optimal right same way with the with the walk through to the backyard it's got all of the this is sort of like to me this seems like the best case scenario for for supporting laneways sweets and then you've got other instances and there's another one just like that and then you have other instances where something like this where this is an existing this structure is actually larger than the main house and this is the backyard I took from the fence because that's the one you showed us before we thought no this is a third example so this is one where there's no access there's no access from the lane to the rear yard and there is there's a number of the house is smaller than the laneway house and there's a number of I mean look at there's a lot of trees because the house nor this is an east-west facing house so you can see the house to the north it's significantly developed so they do have I don't hope that's not a dead tree but that's a tree nonetheless and the Cedars helped to create the privacy but whether this is good bad or indifferent it's just isn't existing it's an existing condition that's all we really wanted to to be able to show you thank you great thank you very much are there any other members with questions of the speaker okay seeing none thank you very much Jennifer I'd like to thank you I'd like to care I call a Karen Gore's line and following Karen's deputation hi Karen welcome back we'll be Glenn Smith just to prepare you oh you're going together okay wonderful Karen and Glenn are you splitting your time or you just combining the five and five okay so have a seat and I'll start your clock will let it run for ten minutes don't have to do anything with the microphone sorry just hit the button so the light is on if the lights on it means your but your microphone is hot ready to go okay thank you very much I always get confused thank you for the opportunity to be here and speak with you Glenn and I are from the ABC or a Karen if you can just hold on if I can ask all the extra chatter in the room just come to just just drop it a little bit we want to be able to hear members of the public we're gonna try that again we're gonna okay go ahead I'm gonna start restarting it started okay thank you appreciate that thank you for the opportunity to speak Glenn and I are from the ABC ra which is the residence Association and we're not here to speak whether laneway houses are good or bad we're really here to talk about the submission the report and on the specific details and we'll be speaking to our outstanding concerns after having gone through the consultation process so I just wanted to set that context before we start we have done a submission there are two there's some policy concerns we have in terms of the provincial policy we really would hope that Toronto would Express and respond to provincial requirements in ways that are both consistent with provincial policy but also makes sense with our urban context and enhancements as a premier world city as and this is anticipated in the provincial policy itself and the Golden Horseshoe Policy the other thing is we are concerned that the neighbourhood policies and the official plan policies two three and four and also our knowledged and confirmed to apply to laneway houses even though they don't specifically in those policies recommend speak to laneway houses as being a possibility we want those same provisions to carry over and apply the second the other thing is we want secondary plans and site-specific policy and obviously heritage districts to have standing with respect to these and not be overridden by the provisions of the laneway houses so and then the other thing is so from that point of view what we would be looking for is assurances in those regards and also assurances or amendment to the OPA 403 to make sure that this is absolutely clear that this is subordinate to those other policies so that's sort of our one point also is when we look at the downtown plan we look at the description of laneways and one thing we do know is that there's different kinds of Lane wise sizes shapes Ted and curves commercial backing and the thing is we to ask all Lane ways to do everything maybe a stretch so what we are saying is we think that Lane ways should be looked and considered into that in terms of their own individual appropriate use there may be some that can support all all uses there may be some that can only support a few uses and we do elaborate on that in terms of that particular point in terms of cook you could have food carts and a little read retail carts and others you can barely get through a car through maybe you have a laneway house but maybe you can't take bikes so there's you know there's a number of things to be taken into consideration with that and then so fine so that just is from the policy context wanting to know that those securities and perfections and there's those protections and there's full clarity on which takes precedence as is upfront why our neighborhoods important we often hear that referred to as the lungs of the city but we think they're much more we think they we already provide a diverse arrange if you go walking down the streets of our neighborhoods they're encircled by large buildings and they're in the context of very high density in some cases they're a respite if you walk through one you sort of you you feel like you're in a different they're on a different place a snapshot of the historical periods and there are differentiation for the City of Toronto so from that point of view that's some of our specifics in terms of a policy context in terms of broad issues we have concerns about accountability and balance once a lane right lane weights our lane way houses are as of right some owner is conferred with rights and benefits and come from another owner adjacent to them and so many so right now people would have access to being aware of a structure usually and it's and be able to look at CEO because committee of adjustment many properties are not even aware but and it's unclear how they will respond and whether to what extent they will call you when someone starts building in the neighborhood the other thing is if someone wants to build an addition to an existing house there they would have to go through the full process there's another point in terms of what benefits are given to individual language houses then are those applicable to other people doing affordable housing or in the neighborhoods in the mixed-use level three and four so there's a number of things along that line that are outlined I think one of the key things is that similar to the toothpaste is it's a lot easier to grow it and build it than to try to mitigate three years later and tried it you can't do a take-back affordability we've talked about that in terms of I've heard conversations on that it questions whether you feel that business is affordable whether the pilot is appropriate accessibility we feel that this is a missed opportunity not to be more aggressive on the accessibility and finally in conclusion we feel that an open streets and service and privacy and overlook have not really been well supported in particular the privacy and overlook which was the main one of the main reasons it wasn't allowed before and there's a few other things in my submission but it's now Glenn's turn okay I'm here to address specifics that are in that are in the draft guidelines right now in the bylaw proposals there seems to be a pressure to move on without actually discussing specifics and I'm kind of concerned that a lot of the meetings including the meetings and the consultations a lot of specifics have not been discussed our goal in part is if this gets implemented and when this gets implemented is to make certain it's done right it was argued that you know this initiative and initiatives like it can provide opportunities for people to live in ground related housing and for residents to live close to where they work shop and play however the current official plan amendment and zoning amendment proposal is limited to the patien area of te whai CC and not being implemented citywide and it's not being considered for implementation citywide the current official plan amendment and zoning amendment proposal also does not address garden and backyard units on properties with no lane access where there may indeed be significant width and depth on properties these ignored opportunities have eliminated a wide range of properties and neighborhoods from offering the benefits that the initiative was intended to bring to the city it's led to consideration of building secondary housing on Lots as narrow as 3 metres and winds will disregarding intensification opportunities and much wider properties merely because those properties don't back onto laneways a study of other jurisdictions show that new cities such as Vancouver in Ottawa backyards and properties that do not back onto laneways are often ideal properties to secondary suite development and those cities have implemented the program simultaneously and looked at this as a combined effort for intensification not for laneways now backyards later but as a city as a whole I'd argue the current proposals provide a single-minded attempt to shoehorn Suites into narrow lanes and properties will ignoring Greater and other intensification opportunities a couple of issues I want to address one is overlooked the focus on laying lay only secondary Suites and the narrow Lots in which they can be permitted has led to potential privacy and low overlook issues the proposal at present allows for as of right permission to build secondary Suites of up to 6 metres if these units are indeed meant to be subordinate to the main building on a lot the maximum height should not be allowed to exceed the height of the main building on the property if this main building is a bungalow a 6-litre secondary unit may become the dominant structure on the property when we permit 6 metres which is 20 feet high for those of us who are not metric oriented we prevent 6 metres to be built as of right we're also potentially adding substantial shadow and overlook on neighboring neighbouring yards and when we build on the net when we do build on the narrowest of possible Lots a 6 metre or 20 foot pulse secondary unit can have major overlooked impact on neighboring properties according to planning amendment second-floor window and fenestration guidelines could not be enforced thus the allowance of six meters as of right should be reconsidered we we proposed single story and it's a four meter should be permitted to be permitted as of right and that two stories six meter units should be subjected to review based on their impact on neighboring properties I also know that second floor dormers are committed in the proposed planning and zoning amendments and these dormers can present significant overlook from second floor suites if they're allowed as of right the proposed amendments also lead substantial reduction in open yard space in many neighborhoods a 5 meter minimum setback has been amended today the four leaders in the bylaw plan set back from the main house which means the one-story suite can promote shrinking of a back yard and sizes in some neighborhoods if you reduce a 7 meter deep yard by 30% and for the new guidelines by up to 42% shrinkage of yard even a 4 meter high secondary unit will cause light Sun issues with neighbors who want to maintain a yard 13 feet is an imposing height we suggest a sound point in me 7.5 meters setback as a minimum for all suites the proposal also allows for roof canopies and awning stuff facing the backyard to be up to 250 2.5 meters in length this means yards can be as small as 2 meters green spaces not covered by canopies we don't think - neither deep lots open spaces should be acceptable when you're out of time your final thought is the one thing they didn't talk about was how traffic may impact the laneway for example no matter what we say delivery services taxis ubers grocery deliveries will be through the laneway not through the front of the house front property that's it just doesn't make sense ok thank you very much are there any questions for the for both the speakers councillor Davis councillor Fletcher mmm I just don't ask for you to repeat again the how you came up with to square two meters could be the yard so what's leftover in terms of the yard size that's if you take into consideration canopies yeah right now the guidelines as of this morning because we only saw them we got them this morning the revised amendment suggests that the space between the original house and the unit the new unit can be as little as four meters four meters the secondary unit is allowed to have a deck with a canopy root and it's also called roof or canopy of up to 2.5 meters or 50% of that yard space so if we have a four meter and of the yards so if we have a whatever is smaller if we have a four meter yard space we're then allowed to cover two meters of that with a canopy for a duct on one of the units and that deck could be four meters high causing shadow on neighborhood properties and basically allowing two meters of yard space if the actual house that's backing on doesn't already have and it's amazing how those cover decks just kind of get walls and yes months later yeah so what I'm saying is today basically when we take a look at these rules I don't think people have really taken a thought at saying what's this gonna look like in the real world let's go to some properties let's go to a range of neighborhoods and actually look at this and measure this so one of the first things I did was go out and measure my garage my car park my car ports taller than I wanted it to be you know how you get designs and you sell designer yeah it's approved go ahead and do it well my my garage is only three meters high and when it was built I was and it's actually taller than most of my neighbor's garages when it was built I was surprised on how much sunlight I lost in all but the peak of summer in my yard I would have liked my garage to be shorter now it would cost me a small fortune to lower it but I lost a lot of sunlight with a three meter high garage and we're saying we're gonna allow four meters as of right and it can be four meters away from a house mm-hmm that strikes me as a not great way to add lunch to the city I'm not opposed to this process in general as I started my discussion I said very much that we should be looking at all kinds of properties not just lean abutting properties because there's great opportunities to build but I don't think you should be focusing as step one on the narrowest possible properties properties as narrow as three meters and winds right be building secondary Suites before we look at how people have really large yards yes so of course if you you could use an air hole very small property and get this extra density just because you're on a lane but you don't even have to use the lane you can use the front whereas there could be much larger properties pardon me wasn't sure that was a question oh if it was you maybe if you'd listened longer okay okay gotten to it so if it is possible then that you could be using some of the poorer candidates for lack of a better word small yards and giving them permissions that would have excessive coverage whereas only because they have a laneway yes where's there might be other properties bigger more appropriate yes we're very Street would not be significant that or not on a lane way but would be much more appropriate because they have larger Lots this this to me is a one-size-fits-all solution that tries to shoehorn units into anywhere you can possibly get one in and also when you look at other jurisdictions I do not recall seeing other jurisdictions that allow for such narrow spaces to be used the Vancouver and Ottawa proposals seem to suggest properties to be much wider now I know Toronto is very different so we shouldn't be using their guidelines because they're not implementable but we can learn from them and why start with the narrowest possible properties the first go-around as a town when we can at least explore maybe three meters isn't the right width maybe four meters from the house isn't ideal or maybe it changes by neighborhoods there are some neighborhoods where people don't have yards already so building a you know replacing your garage or the secondary suite may be fine but there's other other neighborhoods where there's seven meter or a meter deep er yard space Plus garages and why should we allow some reduction of space in yards because of because of these guidelines now I realize this is all puzzle pieces you have to build into a property so I need to be suggesting a worst-case scenario but I do see if I was to apply it to my yard I can reduce my own yard by about six or eight feet right now legally according to the guidelines and that doesn't even get into the issues like how wide the line is and all that good stuff okay thank you thank you very much councillor Davis councillor Fletcher I just wondered and I missed that where your residents Association is located in the nature of those homes it sounds like you have tiny Lots where you are well we we have a mix ABC is bounded in the south by Bloor Street on the north by the CPR tract Sandler's between Avenue and Yonge so we're all of the Yorkville Hazleton all the dogs of high-intensity development along new york fill after the cpr we have three neighborhoods we have the camera of the names the ramsden which is north of ramsden park we have asked with in Yorkville and some of our streets have very narrow properties and so our streets are fairly wide properties and our laneways are extremely laying dead and and sharp curved mirrors because it's a very old part of the city so what I'm hearing one of your concerns is just the size of the Lots and I also heard you mentioned something about the width of the lane waste your lane ways fairly wide or narrow very narrow very narrow very my measured one at nine point six feet so you're suggesting supposed to within that if you can thank garden I'm just you're suggesting that in this report we should be considering the nature size of the laneway and that are you suggesting we would exclude a certain width of laneway from this or certain lot width based on the impact of being so close and losing sunlight which I've heard you talk about let me speak you feel that's been looked at let me ask you this do you feel that's been considered enough and what's before us today let me speak to one piece and then I'll pass it over to Glenn in terms of the lane way the city looks at five meter wide lane ways if Lane way houses would be going in that we would have to factor in its the expansion of the size of Lane way not necessarily immediately but permit that in addition to any setback for the landscaping or bicycle parking or whatever so we would want to have that factored in as part of it and maybe what I get sorry that said right now the plan does not allocate to have minimum five meter wide lanes plus setback for the units there's just a total setback number from the lane no matter how narrow the lien is I'm just gonna go after my question was that something obviously you've had these conversations as part of your consultation correct yes do you feel that your concerns are reflected here today and what's in front of us or that that's something that we need to do a little bit more work on to look after some of the situations you're describing to us today and I think probably our and some of the really really old parts of the City of Toronto compared to some of the newer subdivisions where the lanes may be fine iíve seen lanes in the city that are bigger than our street our public street oh you're suggesting I didn't suggest it around what you're asking us for here I'm suggesting we need to do some more work to look at appropriate uses I think its width of lane ways with and width of lots to be factored into some of the conversations that what you're asking yes okay thank you I just wanted to be really clear thank you and yes we have brought these points up before yes but no you're talking to us exactly thank you clear what you're asking and thank you for your question of making us be clear thank you very much counselor for the questions anyone else okay seeing none thank you very much for the residents for their deputation technically on the list Nexus Mike Collins but I believe that there's been an arrangement to allow Michelle sanaya to speak first because Michelle has to leave Michelle's and I are you here still oh you're still here so let's get you in here and Michelle you'll have five minutes when you're ready all right thanks so much everyone for juggling around the schedule I know that can be hard sometimes my name is Michelle sanaya I'm co-founder and executive director of the laneway project we're a not-for-profit planning in place making organization and we're focused on unlocking the potential of Toronto's laneways as complete public spaces that are fully integrated into the public realm of the city so I'm here to speak specifically sort of to that angle and we do that through demonstration project through planning policy improvements and also through the development of public planning resources so over the last three and a half years we've worked with local communities to improve laneways in more than 25 neighborhoods throughout the city running sort of the length and breadth of that laneway network and and we do this because and you know as we've heard from various people today and I'm sure through some of the other the other items that you're considering we know that neighborhoods with a range of tools and options which can help them to tailor growth to their particular context are more able to grow as unique and livable communities and you know a livable community to us is one that has along with you know as we've heard today a diversity of high-quality housing options also a diversity of high-quality public spaces available near to where people live so it's noted sort of variously in the Toronto Complete Streets guidelines the upcoming public realm amendment to the Official Plan and the upcoming teok or propose downtown plan that laneways in particular are well-placed to augment the city's pedestrian network by providing additional safe and accessible walking routes and that where possible they should be designed with consideration for safe accessible and comfortable pedestrian and cyclist movement and then focusing on residential lane ways in particular it's noted that they have the opportunity to become attractive public spaces that support informal play and social interaction for surrounding residents and sort of the reason that this is relevant to today's discussion is that laneway Suites can really help to unlock this potential inherent in our city's laneways as safe and appealing public spaces and routes by activating them with you know routine everyday use passive surveillance and also to design features like lighting and greening to improve the attractiveness and also the public space amenity of those laneways and their usefulness to local residents so I guess that that's sort of it in a nutshell I like to keep it short and sweet um but but I'm here to strongly recommend that the Toronto and East York Community Council adopt the proposed opions zoning amendments to help to add this tool to the toolkit that the city has to work with and and to help to unlock the potential of our laneways to help to help us as we grow to foster sort of sensitive growth and a vibrant public realm in our neighborhoods thanks Michele thank you very much for your remarks are there any questions for the speaker I seeing none thank you I'd like to call Mike Colin Williams Colin's Williams Ontario Home Builders Association Mike welcome good afternoon my name is Mike Collins Williams and I'm the director of policy for the Ontario Home Builders Association and I'm also a registered professional planner Ohba represents 4,000 member companies organized into a network of 29 local associations across Ontario with our largest here in Toronto known as built I am pleased to be here today to speak about gentle density and laneway housing a couple of years ago through the GTA housing Action lab the Ontario Home Builders Association partnered with the Pembina Institute to produce a joint reports app copies here that I'd be pleased leave behind make way for lane way this was a unique partnership as you don't often see get a development industry partnering with an environmental organizations but I think in this particular case the public policy rationale to support laneway housing is simply so strong that it makes perfect sense for a wide variety of stakeholder organizations such as home builders Association's and clean energy environmental think tanks work together we received a number of endorsements and positive media about laneways following the report in the brief time I do have I'm gonna hit on a couple highlights of the reports we are in short supply affordable housing and walkable amenity rich urban neighborhoods close to rapid transit these desirable residential streets are complies mostly of detached and semi detached houses with purchase prices and rental rates beyond the reach of most residents people often see a binary choice of single-family vs. high-rise condos but there's a whole other universe of housing options planners often refer to the missing middle today I want to address a specific segment of that the so called small-scale housing options the old city of Toronto and East York has a huge opportunity to promote and increase the supply of what planners call gentle density this means providing more housing supply in established neighborhoods without changing the look feel or character of these communities as a housing solution laneway housing creates invisible density you don't actually alter the look and feel of these existing neighborhood streets by adding housing to underutilized laneways tucked in behind existing homes and these established communities in Toronto and East York are typically in transit and efficient neighborhoods which contrasts sharply with much of the rest of the GTA laneway is an innovative public policy opportunity for established and typically very expensive transit efficient neighborhoods the latest census data actually shows that many established so-called stable hoods neighbourhoods are anything but stable back in the 1960s and 70s a lot of these neighborhoods actually had higher populations families typically had more children and a lot of our older housing stock was split up with more secondary suites and ancillary apartments through demographic changes where families are having less kids an aging population and through the slow but steady process of gentrification the fact days that some of our most well-connected transit accessible neighborhoods are actually declining in population one way to address this is through innovative small-scale housing options such as secondary Suites small-scale infill and Lane weight housing I'd also like to point out for home believers that small housing options are typically more affordable for people to rent than entire homes or condo yoots units even in purpose-built rental units buildings this is a great way to very slightly increased densities near transit and offer more ground oriented housing is not everybody wants to rent in a high-rise Tower the time I have left let me quickly just mention some benefits reduces car dependence by locating more housing near transit and amenities laneway housing will help retail on our main streets as I mentioned before some of these neighborhoods have declined in population over the last couple of decades and we can support local retail with local population laneway housing can help cover the primary lot owners mortgage we've seen it with secondary Suites and hopefully soon with laneways that in an expensive city like Toronto the secondary source of rental income will actually help with affordability for the primary homeowner lean way and other small-scale housing options will provide local ridership and support local transits and finally of course we need to keep providing housing supply and ground oriented housing options as this will ultimately produce pressure for urban expansion in the suburbs I'll close by mentioning some other jurisdictions Vancouver's his own zoning allows for laneways behind most almost all singles limited to one and a half stories 500 to a 900 square feets california's bill 1866 requires local government to consider second unit applications and promotes accessory units in existing in future single family lots seattle has made accessory dwelling units legal through a permit process the city has removed parking and ownership requirements and other barriers such as height setbacks max square footage and min lot size requirements so we weren't alone in Toronto and exploring this there are other North American jurisdictions doing this as well so thank you for listening to my presentation and I'm hopeful that you'll adopt and move forward with with this package I'd be happy to take any questions and as noted earlier I did bring copies of the joint Oh H ba hem de Institute report make way for lane wave which I'll leave behind thank you very much are there any questions for the speaker seeing none thank you for that very thorough presentation you're our next speaker is sara klemme Haga are you still here I saw her earlier today Sarah Clement Haga had to leave and she asked me to read her deputation aloud on her bath I think that would be permitted you'll have five minutes go ahead please thank you for the opportunity to voice my support for the laneway suite final report I'm sorry I couldn't stay to give it in person I would like to stay to my strong support for this official plan and zoning amendment that would allow lamely Suites as of right in Toronto in East York I support this for two reasons first I have neighbors around my home that are interested in laneway suites and I'd be very happy for them to convert their sheds to a laneway house I myself have a garage that is mostly unused that I'd be happy to create as housing one day in the future for my children should they wish to stay in Toronto assuming they want to live in their mom's backyard the laneway my backyard is an untended litter strewn space I believe with Langley housing the laneway would be safer and more vibrant so I say yes in my backyard housing I also support lamely houses for Toronto East York and hope to see them widely used is one of the housing solutions and the rest of the city it's the type of gentle density increase that has big potential for both providing additional housing and from making our land weights attractive cared for spaces I appreciate the hard work of the staff and all involved in the creation of this report I fully support the adoption of the staff report and look forward to it being passed both here and later on council and hope you'll move ahead with this important and promising initiative thanks for your attention ok thank you very much any questions for the speaker okay seeing none thank you very much our next speaker is Liam asta Leah welcome hi my name is Liam Aston and I'm an architect and the owner of firma architecture my architectural practice is focused on plane way buildings and I have been since 2011 really dedicated to designing laneway buildings and because of the city's initiatives recently to promote laneway housing I've been approached by about a hundred Torontonians that are interested in building laneway homes so what that's giving me is a sense of what is what people are looking for what people are needing and wanting in laneway houses and before I begin I'd like to say that the progress the city is made in reconsidering laneways has been remarkable from the consultations and studies by lane scape to the campaign by councillors McMahon and by Lao to move the issue forward and Council to the final reports by the urban planning department and I very much support the current proposal for laneways Suites however I'm asking for amendments to two items so we're gonna look at those two items on slides and they're both regarding the design criteria that stated in the current proposal so the first one is about the 45 degree angle er plane restriction so this is a slide of the 4045 degree angular plane restriction and what that means in terms of interior space that can mean the the equivalent of a bedroom like cutting out that area because you can't walk under it's not like you can't if it's to the root the ceiling level is too low to walk walk under it all and an extra bedroom can mean annexed housing an extra person in a laneway house so this is one reason why we think you should consider not including the angular plane another issue that comes up with the angular plane restriction is that it makes construction more complex because there are two types of roofs a flat roof and a sloped roof and what that means is you need two kinds of roofers it makes construction more complex and that can add cost to building a laneway house now we realize that the angular plane is a result of the shadow study and that in terms of the loft space there's a proposal to make the laneways feet larger but that doesn't actually apply to most sites so what we would be asking for is to omit the angular plane requirement which would allow a greater number of people to be housed by laneway houses and it would make construction more efficient and affordable um my second point is about the enjoyment of laneways Suites so this one is going to be about roof terraces we think that roof terraces are one of the great advantages of that you can design in in a laneway suite and they should be allowed as of right this is an it adds additional green space and if you have a flat roof on a building why not use it as a garden I think that's something that people really desire in in laneway Suites and it should be considered part of good lane weight suite design there's a concern about overlooking neighbors that that issue can be mitigated by setting back the guardrails on the roof garden and regarding these two points we created a petition that was based on the March 29th changing lanes document there was also a third point on basements but that's already been integrated so we're happy about that our petition has over 270 signatures so the signatures that you see in the petition are people who've been involved in the laneway in the laneway debate since since the beginning they are laneway advocates like Effie Carson they're respected architects like Bridget Jim and Howard sat cliff they're journalists like Jeremy freed they're people that have built blaine way homes like rochelle Rubinstein they're people that would like to build laneway homes like Henry Fletcher there are 273 people that have also kind of concur on these these issues that relate to good laneway building design so in summary um we'd like to say that we support laneways Suites but we'd recommend not cutting into the buildings with the angular angular planes that back and also allowing rooftop gardens thank you wonderful thank you very much are there any questions for the speaker seeing none thank you our next speaker is sue Dexter sue welcome thank you kindly oh the first thing I'd like to do is to reassure the counselors who have brought this change into our purview that we want a good policy that's right and the lane waist suite should occur as a result of it we don't have a problem we have a problem with rush we want to get it right so here's here's the kind of the kind of thing that we've been facing this morning we got a the the most recent version in which on page three we have a minimum of 60% of the distance between the rear main wall of the residential building the front main wall of the ancillary building containing a laneway Street must be for soft landscaping this is a net loss it's sixty percent now of five meters on a one-story building it was five meters until this morning except there was a problem raised saying there were ancillary buildings and we had to we had to take those into account you know sheds and all that sort of stuff we we have a real problem with these kind of changes there's another change and we we kind of don't understand what the impact would be we had a change 8x8 was the original one then it became 8 by 10 meters 10 meters there's no garage that I know of that's 10 meters in the City of Toronto if you're talking garage replacement Bravo but but let's really sit down and talk about the consequences of this the other thing is the exclusion of four plates floor space index the gross listen to the laneway sweet interior for the interior floor area of an ancillary building containing a laneway suite must be less than the interior floor area of a residential building on a lot by how much by how much a square centimeter a meter five meters what are we talking about we've always talked about the ancillary build if the laneway suite being less than the main house but now we're talking about it can really crowd the main house so we need standards in this to ensure that we get we got a really good bill coming out okay you know where I'm from I'm the old neighborhood exactly councillor Fletcher has it on the money we got narrow lanes we got this Lane those lanes we're a growing area in the City of Toronto we have more housing types than can be counted we've got triple X's duplexes basement units rooming houses for us a laneway suite would be a tertiary or quaternary use okay I think it is they use it in geology all the time so we're no stranger to density and we're no enemy of density our objective today is to ensure the plan is clear and watertight that the objectives the city desires are met and that the official plans stable neighborhood policies are respected that's not too much to ask we don't think we analyzed our lanes you know all about that what have we got we've got affordable the biggest question mark in the world over affordable units these are the ones that are really critical this is the these sort of folks that are really really suffering in our town and we have to do something about that thank you density why would we lose gfa it's it's it's the easiest measure of infrastructure demand including schools hospitals parks parking among others green space five meters for a one-story 7.5 meters and you're now digging basements so we have to look at that because the city also has policies to increase the the the canopy they're going to put the sewer and water lines through the yard into the suite my trees share their root system with my neighbors so you're not only impacting the unit tree you're impacting potentially its girls its growth space on both sides we're not against it but let's get it right okay so appeals we're gonna have a peel I'm very sorry but we've run out of both perhaps someone may have many many a question about it okay well I'd like to acknowledge a counselor by Lao then counsellor fragile Decker's so let me see so believe you're not in okay we're not against it but for example yeah one of the reasons why we need all the servicing connected to the main house is it was key in order to get this done that is that is key so if you are against that no no not against we're racing it as a concern but how do you solve the concern we we put in special rules where this is how you trench this is how you do it okay no rezoning on an official plan amendment it's not an official plan we're talking Assaf right I understand but the guidelines can deal with stuff like that absolutely but we're talking about a zoning bylaw an official plan amendment right now yeah but we've got regulations that you're talking about this is zoning bylaw times and you think that the zoning bylaw should specify how people do the drainage to the unit well it's if you can't you can't hold one good and and create a policy that negates the good understand when you there any zoning in the city that talks about how we do a drainage to a building or a house I've no idea I'm wearing it as I understand but I think we need to be straightforward and when we're talking about raising problems and I understand and I and you all these residents associations have been very helpful in working with a city and brought very important issues to the table but there's there are issues that are going to be key and that might be a point that we're gonna have to agree to disagree what we may have to but let's let's really know of a good conversation about it can you do anything if we're getting policy on the morning the you're discussing something policy changes regulation changes but but this regulation for example with the drainage has been they want because the first condition about creating laneway housing is that it was not severable and all the services had to come from the main house we have a concern and we would like to discuss it and maybe at the end of the day you'll say go do ok but but you need to we need to we have to speak for the trees they're not they can't speak for themselves so it is a concern on what what will happen with respect i mean i'm we're not saying kill it because of the trees but boy let's try to get that right ok thank you very much councillor bi-lo councillor fridge' Dacus thanks sue so much for coming out and speaking on I just wanted to follow up on on your question towards the end there about trees and servicing from the main house to the laneway suite and root systems are you aware that the private tree mile if you apply to do work on your property the private tree by law does not damage your entry exactly yes ok so you are aware of that so I'm just wondering so if they can cut down the tree as a right to do the construction on their property then well it's a it's a problem and there's wiggle room and all the policies you know in our experience dealing with see of a stuff and this when when trees entry and and death comes to the council council always says don't do it but those ones that come to council mostly are ones on driving some of them are private a lot of them are City yeah okay so you just want clarity about how you get the services to the laneways suite that doesn't actually damage another policy that we have which just grow the tree canopy not diminish answerin okay thank you thank you very much councillor anyone else questions of the speakers seeing none thank you sue I would like to invite Chris spoke to come and speak nice to see you again Chris when you're ready you have five minutes sure good afternoon my name is Chris Polk and I'm a member of housing matters we are a group of Torontonians who advocate for increased housing supply to address the housing availability and affordability crisis that is pricing many renters young people and middle-class families out of our city we take very seriously the common-sense notion that if we want more people to live in Toronto we're going to need to build more housing I appreciate being granted the opportunity today to comment on the city's review of linguist Suites and we'd like to start by thanking planning staff for the diligent work that went into this file as many of you know our rental vacancy rate at 1.1 percent is now the lowest it's been in 16 years this metric which we use as a measure of available housing units points to a clear supply problem in Toronto it is on that basis and to keep this brief that we as an organization are enthusiastic supporters of laneways Suites the city has estimated that we could see up to 300 laneways suites constructed in Toronto where they to be allowed and to make that a little less abstract that's up to 300 homes for up to 300 households per year in the city laneways Suites on their own will not solve our supply problem but they take us in the right direction and frankly they're long overdue for the sake of those 300 potential households per year we urge you to please say yes to laneways suites and to vote in favor of adopting this package thank you thank you very much for your deputation any questions councillor may have a housing matters whose housing matters so we're a group of Torontonians mostly renters who advocate for increased housing availability and affordability so you're not for profit we're not-for-profit organizations that's right thank you thank you okay thank you very much counselor counselor McMahon thank you very much and just following up on that so your membership is it people of your generation or all generations or all generations it skews younger excuse renter and excuse aspiring homeowner so you this policy is very important to you as you mentioned this is very important to us as a first step in a signal that council is serious about addressing the supply issue in Toronto right and which like test to pass it today or different pass it today should've been passed 100 years ago okay thank you very much counselor our our next speaker and I believe may be our final speaker is bridget shim there will be no sub who will be no stranger to this matter but I'm not sure she's in this room I don't see her anymore she must be working bridgett shim okay okay so Bridget's not in the room are there any member any other members of the public here to speak to this matter okay seeing none we're ready to bring it into Community Council for some questions of staff who has questions of stuff and if I can just see an indication of hands counselors you had lots of questions for the deputies this is your chance don't be shy now otherwise course is going straight to motions okay I'll go how's that house I've got some questions I haven't asked any questions as of yet I'll just start my own clock er with respect to some of the the comments that we've heard today from the deputies and I appreciate there was a range of opinions the the affordable housing question for me is a very curious one because there wasn't really some clarity on the cost per square foot and and including how do you ensure that there is some way of obtaining even a modest number of affordable housing can I ask Taft to provide some some clarity on their position on this this is not really going to be a tool to to bring forth a wide range of affordable housing options given the very expensive cost to build these single household dwellings is that correct do you madam Gerry yes the we look at these as an additional type of rental unit not necessarily a solution to the provision of affordable rental units I believe Sean from the affordable housing office is here or was here and it indicated you may have something to say on the matter of affordability as well unless he is no longer here that's okay thank you I think you did answer the question that I basically thought so that's very helpful for me with respect to the neighborhoods that already have a layer of planning protection that dives into it at a more detailed level for example secondary plans Heritage Conservation districts how will this new OPA and zoning bylaw amendment affect those existing documents will those documents be good standing will they be sort of given a luster reading how will these four pieces layer on top of one another so one of the policies in the proposed Official Plan amendments states that any secondary plans and existing site an area specific policies will prevail over the policy that is proposed so in areas that have policies which would preclude the construction of laneways Suites because in either a secondary plan or a site in area specific policy area they contain wording that prevents the creation of new units that for instance do not represent the prevailing character and if that prevailing character does not include laneways Suites then those policies would prevent the creation of laneway Suites those policies would prevail over what is proposed today we aren't aware of many of those but we are certainly looking into the policy that was raised in the AB communication okay so any existing document already in place and registered and recognized by the city they will take precedent before this new application on top of it in terms of secondary plans and sidon area specific policies that is correct okay thank you that's very helpful so there are a number of technical opinions out there and I heard a wide range of it with respect to the amount of height the angular Plains the setbacks of step backs the amount of green cover how you perhaps to enter and egress the these new Suites lots of opinions out there have you considered any modeling to ensure that any concerns that are out there perhaps could be either confirm or debunked we have we actually looked at several neighborhoods across the study area with different lot patterns and characteristics in the application of the the guidelines the zoning standards that you see before you today and our urban design staff did a considerable considerable amount of work modeling these on both an area wide and a site-specific basis that were conformed our recommendations and can we have access to that work I could provide that information yes okay that would be wonderful thank you and with respect to I think every you know every four years our bills or tax bills get reassessed and and sometimes we are surprised to see that how much the homes are worth I'm a renter so I really don't know but for those who are homeowners can I ask that the every four year assessment a a new addition let's call it an addition er or new density measuring the quantum of five six seven hundred square feet in perhaps larger how how much more will the cfa be projected into the future like did you folks get a sense of how much more there will be for that for the taxpayer and then how much more there is for the for the cost of service delivery by way of government services so with regard to the assessment of the property it's not something that we would typically look into with a policy initiative but we did my understanding is that if you're constructing additional floor space either by an addition to the house or a laneway suite impact or the municipal property assessment corporation which would review the assessment would consider that additional floor space either on a periodic review or when the building permit was it was submitted and they would make their assessment on the value of that i we don't have any estimates of what that would look like on in one way or another okay so I've run out of time so I respect the clock councillor perks question so first one of the deputies raised the issue of its saying that it may be a residential use my understanding and correct me if I'm wrong is that that allows the same kind of in-home commercial activity that are currently permitted in houses in neighborhoods like a home hairdressing through the chair that is my understanding yes okay and would the same there are restrictions about that in terms of what percentage of the overall building can be the business how does that figure in here that's correct the home occupation provisions are similar to those that exist for the main house on a lot in the parents owing by law so this isn't allowing like a storefront type commercial operation this is I do some work at home and there's a written category that's always been there for residential and that category is the one that will be applied here that is correct okay over to forestry I was looking at the report and you know I was listening to some of the deputies the concerns around trees and on page 37 I it says city planning staff suggests the approval of the removal of any tree under the private tree bylaw continued to be at the discretion of the general manager of parks forestry and recreation so how will that discretion be applied what what will the guiding at ethos or principles of the general manager of parks forestry and Recreation be if someone comes in and says I want to remove a tree in order to get my laneway house built maybe on the microphone and if you could just introduce yourself please hello through you madam chair in this yes my name is voi Camille you know which I'm the planner with city of Durban first I'm talking here so anyway the the discretion of the general manager is with reflect through the fact that we are not obliged to issue up under the tree protection by Allah we are not obliged to issue a permit to injure or remove to remove a tree if the construction is warranted as right so when it comes to the laneway suits urban forestry will actually review the applications and reserve the right to refuse the application to remove a tree and in those cases the applicant would be required to revise the proposal in such a way that the tree would be protected to our satisfaction okay so in the event that they come to you and they say there is absolutely no way I can build this without injuring or removing a tree will the general manager protect healthy trees in most cases we would protect but if it's impossible to protect the tree then we would look for compensations okay all right I think I understand better how that's going to work yeah okay okay are there any other questions hold on councillor perks are you have you concluded your questions Thank You members who are interested in in asking questions just indicate and I will put you on the list and then we are gonna channel it to our next speaker which is counts councillor fractured Dacus I may just add something to the urban forestry question just to highlight policies within the proposed Official Plan amendment that speaks specifically to chapter 8 1 three of the municipal code which deals with bylaw trees and this actually is is something that has raised for laneway sweets are proposed to be raised for laneways sweets but not for any other type of development within neighborhoods so in our view the contents of the report and the Official Plan amendment that is before you actually goes beyond what the current requirements for development in neighborhoods are with regard to tree protection so just for context so if I could ask a follow-up then yes given that there seems to be a little uncertainty around this one would it be possible to have some clarifying language provided either if this gets deferred or if this goes on to council so that we can understand that a healthy tree will not be removed to build a laneway suite in a subsequent report if that is requested we could certainly provide additional information that will help clarify the practice of building permit and tree permit issuance or not thank you thank you thank you very much counselor counselor fracas questions yes thanks I see building staff in the house and I have a question because the this is a proposal for the Toronto and East York district so any stork we have coverage that we deal with on applications that go to the committee of adjustment and I wanted to get some understanding from you and for the benefit of others in the room around how like we treat coverage of laneways Suites get permitted as of right that means secondary Suites are something that people in East York go to get legalized and then the accessory building otherwise known as a garage in some instances has a certain amount of coverage attributed to it and the house has a certain amount of coverage attributed to it so I'm just wondering like if they're permitted as of right how does that how does that work so through you madam chair is should an application come before us and if there is a bylaw that's permitting laneways Suites whatever the requirements are the prescriptive requirements are in the bylaw we would apply that in reviewing building permit applications for a particular lot or a specific development should the application not comply with the performance standards in the bylaw such that it's over in the permitted coverage we would identify that as a variance and of course then the applicant has the ability to apply to committee of adjustment to seek approval of that variance if the variance is ultimately granted that would legalize it in terms of normalize it in terms of a zoning and a building permit could be issued so this process isn't actually going to be eliminating that aspect of the process by which people who go to the committee of adjustment to seek variances to the existing bylaws that are in effect in particular around each stroke I realize that other people are in this chamber and are members of council are not councillors in that area and subject to that particular bylaw so so again anybody can seek a variance to the bylaws or the performance standards in the bylaw and those are going to be reviewed by the committee adjustment based on the four tests and the Planning Act I'll let my colleagues and planning's speak to that but yeah somebody can certainly apply for a variance should they not comply with the right so what I was trying to say is that we are not actually through this process eliminating that step in the attempt to make legalized this kind of housing type no so in instances where a proposed laneway suite does not meet the requirements and the criteria in the proposed bylaw then the owner the person looking to build the laneway suite could make an application as is their right into the Planning Act or variances to the bylaw if an application to the building department is made that meets all of the standards in the proposed zoning bylaw amendments then that suite could be constructed as of right without a trip to the committee of adjustment as no variances would be necessary so so for the coverage aspects so I mean it's a 35% in East or odd for the lot if they come in and and their garage is combined with the house at 35% then they don't need to go and seek any variances at the committee of adjustment they can just do it however if the proposal includes a structure that is larger than what is permitted that is an accessory building at the moment separate from the main house than they would have to go to the committee of adjustment no I believe the intent is that similar to the comments about density the the coverage would be exempted for the construction of a laneway suite I believe that is the intent of the bylaw and I would ask my colleagues in the zoning team to clarify if indeed the both of those provisions apply if they do then then you are correct again as mario suggested if there are a areas where the proposal is not in compliance with the bylaw whether it's this bylaw or it's the parent bylaw that this is proposing to amend they may seek variances in that regard so sorry you were deferring to somebody on us to answer your question who I don't know who you're speaking at Carolyn over the owning team there my colleague Carolyn I'll respond it's close layman from the zoning team I'm the because currently that exemption for a lot coverage is not in the bylaw we were not directed to include it so it's not there right now FSI has been addressed but not a lot coverage oh well then I guess it's a good thing that we're going to be deferring this item for a month so we can speak to that as well thank you very much okay our next councillor to question is council lady okay thank you very much I know that this did there's there was some question as to changes that were made with the Supplemental that was submitted today and I'm wondering if we could just get that a colles notes of what changes those were between the bylaw and the report specifically around the the setback from the primary building just so we'd get some clarity sorry to confirm the the question was a summary of the changes that were made to the zoning belt so in in my opinion the changes that were made to the zoning bylaw were largely for clarifications sake what we tried to do responds to the a lot of the questions that came up in the correspondence that was being received over the last few days with regard to certain provisions within the bylaws so that's why we look to change the wording not in a substantial or material way but in a way to clarify the intent of the report as staff would normally do making technical or stylistic amendments before the bylaw proceeded from community council to council as the case often is so I can certainly provide a list of what those are quickly please well there were a number of specific changes the one regarding the separation distance was intended to address the amount of landscaped open space that was required to be provided between the main house and the laneways Suites and the intent of the report is that that space not be diminished the amount of space that is required to be provided in the rear yard should still be provided in that space so what it means is a higher percentage of that area because it's a smaller overall area has to be landscaped open space we can certainly take a look at the bylaw and insure before any zoning bylaw gets the council that it implements the intent of the report which is not to diminish the requirements in the zoning bylaw to provide open space in neighborhoods in rear yards so but with respect to the setback from the between the two structures that has not changed that has not changed the monitoring and enforcement of the hardscapes and landscaping provisions do we have any advice to have because right now we're doing a pretty terrible job of it I don't see how I don't see anything to suggest that it would get any better we have people paving over front yards not for parking pads and we we can't make them change so I'm just wondering if there's any provisions that you've suggested the the tool that we have to secure landscaped open space on a lot is the zoning bylaw and if there are lots which are deficient or if a permit application comes in and it's deficient on the required landscaped open space then the building department will raise that as a deficiency with above any ID how many we actually enforced last year personally I do not lighting in laneways for laneway safety have have we evaluated what we can get Toronto Hydro to do to improve the lighting of laneways with with laneway housing so we've met several times with Toronto Hydro throughout this process they currently provide what I think they consider vehicle level lighting within laneways and through the monitoring pro period we're going to continue to work with them to assess where the uptake is for lane wave Suites and whether there are any necessary improvements to laneways with regard to lighting so at the moment there's nothing for including pedestrians or cyclists from accessing the lane ways but they do present an opportunity for improved lighting but once we have more people actively using the lane ways there may be a need for us to address the safety issues that come with the amount of lighting that I would agree the other side is on of the public safety side is sidewalks sidewalks and Lane ways and Lane weight quality the quality of the of the pavement is any of that indicated in the report that that would have to get reviewed in some way and improved or upgraded in the event that transportation services may want to weigh in further but the report does talk about the current service provision and maintenance of Lane ways and that at this time again it's difficult to estimate where the uptake will be of Lane way sweets any specific improvements to areas related to laneways sweets are not planned at this time but as they are constructed as you said there may be a need to improve or well improve the surfacing and maybe other characteristics of lanes but I would defer to my colleagues and transportation services if they have anything further to add in that regard if they don't cuz I have one more question for plane who came up with the name of the report it was my partner Eleanor she has all the good eye thank out thank Eleanor very much for yet again another good name for one of your planning reports this is not the first while the next West thing the Cask force shall I go on Greg you can thank you very much counselor our next counselor to question is counselor Davis I just want to ask again about trees and I think I'll ask buildings if what is the relationship between the building code and our private tree by law which has which prevails the driver for this sorry tree protection bylaws both city and private tree bylaws are not applicable law as listed under the Building Code Act and its associated regulations therefore a building permit will be issued despite the fact that it may need that the resulting construction may injure or damage a protected tree we do not have the ability to withhold the building permit for tree protection bylaws as they are not listed as applicable law having said having said that building permits are not the only applicable approval when developing a property and of course the owner or developer or whoever's building the project still needs to comply with any associated city bylaws that may be applicable a lot a building you're saying they could get a building permit to Nazarite building permit and forestry will say no to injuring a tree and they are left with what remedy I can't comment on what forestry will or will not say but I cannot well we just sorry if what we heard is that they would Maya they should not find a solution to redesign and avoid which I know they do which avoids an injury of removal and they choose not to approve a removal or an injury and it conflicts with you wishing a building permit what remedy does an applicant have beyond part of the building permit process we inform applicants and it educate with respect to the private tree bylaw give them information about the need to protect private and public trees and ask them to work closely with forestry interpretive forestry in terms of having a design that could that does protect trees ultimately however if a building permit application complies with the zoning bylaw and applicable law it must be issued forestry then can consider whether or not it will issue a permit to remove a tree or ask for some mitigating compensations such as additional tree planting this is no different this is no different this is no different than any situation when someone is building a single-family dwelling or any type of dwelling that complies so it's entirely the same as what happens now and right now there are many many permits issued for the removal of trees in order to build so what we're talking about status quo except I understand there's now some provision you're proposing to put into the Official Plan policy if this has some kind of teeth why have we not done it before I'm I'm not sure who that oh no no planning to whoever put in the Official Plan provision there the intent of the Official Plan provision was to acknowledge that we had heard concerns about the removal of mature trees and neighborhoods through the process and in that urban forestry is one of the many divisions that are participating in the monitoring process as laneway sweets may be constructed we want to ensure that the policies reflect the fact that City Planning and urban forestry staff will work together on any changes that may be necessary to a laneway suite design to save immature tree where possible okay the policies also consider that minor variance applications that allow for the saving of a tree and changing of the building envelope will be considered by staff okay basically the same what I did want to ask you it had to do with the comments that were made about narrow lots and with the changes that are proposed about setbacks distance from the house and so on and canopies and porches on sweets and leaving behind potentially to meter lots it first of all that's a possibility with these zoning standards is that correct I don't know that I agree with the interpretation necessarily but will certainly take that back and look further at what the provision would mean in practice and if I heard the previous question from councillor Fraga Dacus then the coverage provisions in the existing bylaws are still in effect and so if the whose coverage provisions are not met current coverage provisions not met with the addition of secondary suite or laneway suite they would not be as of right buildings and they would need variances the intent of the bylaw in my view is we added a coverage provision for laneway Suites which I think maxes out at 30% of the size of the law the intent of adding that provision was so that the laneway suite would not be subject to other provisions related to coverage in the so if that's that in my view is a clarification that would be that could be built into the bylaw before it advances thank you very much our next councillor to question as councillor Matt Lowe my questions with my colleague I want to begin with tennis protection because I've heard some debate over the protection of the trees and I've heard certainly evergreens submission regarding public realm improvements and I've heard these submission about the impact and affordability but is it fair to say that the preponderance if not all of these suites are gonna have fewer than seven units they're gonna have six or fewer units and if that's so is it not true that that these tenants who we be welcoming in to these new units would have few to no protections under the RTA the the report proposes the to permit the construction of an individual rental unit on on a lot I believe it is correct that that one unit if it were proposed to be removed would not be subject to the policies the city's rent to replacement policies but if there's anything to add maybe through a lawyer the furniture how one of our housing experts sure yeah so through the chair yes the Residential Tenancies Act speaks to protecting residential complexes of five or more units and our official plan policies speak to where there's six or more so if there's there could be the main property may have three units and the laneway suites could or may have five units it could reach that level but it's most likely that it would not so if if the owner that the owner of the property says let's say they've got a tenant and they say we were guess what we're moving our our daughter is coming back from college and we want to move her in they can just boot that tenant out really whatever they want the Residential Tenancies Act has provisions related to personal use which state that they need to compensate a tenant up to one month for one month's rent and it has to be a dependent or someone associated so much the same as if you had a basement apartment and you want to move in your parent into that unit the laneway suite would have those same provisions yeah but they don't have a secure tenancy that's correct thank you I'll be moving a motion with regard to that priority when I speak later the other question another question I have is so I think all of us agree that there is an affordability crisis in our city and that we have far too many people who can't even live in our city right now due to that fact candidly what impact does staff believe if we move forward with the laneway housing initiative what real impact will it have and I you know I've heard you know some people have said it will have no impact I'm just talking like rhetorically some people have said ah this is nothing what are you doing this is and then other people have said this is like a panacea this is one of the big answers I'm not saying she's suggesting the champions here have said that but that's the rhetoric out there candidly what are we doing here with respect to affordability would in your own words I don't know that permitting laneway Suites will have an impact on the provision of affordable rental units within the city in my view will have some impact on the provision of rental units generally in the city as one so to increase supply but it won't necessarily mean that it will be affordable I'd say that's an accurate characterization yes councilor are you okay thank you sorry one other one other thing if we're we're were their residence right now like we've got different types of lanes in the Toronto and East Shore community council area and there are some lanes that have more of a for lack of a better term you know more of a kind of a you know downtown or urban feel with the graffiti and you know those kind of lanes you guys know what I'm talking about and and then you've got and then you've got then you've got other lanes in in other parts of you know certainly in Midtown and even in cancer viola ward and others that are served on the fringes of the downtown that have you know I would even call it a Buick feel where there's like it's you know some tall grass growing out the sides and it kind of feels like a rural rural Lane has there been much discussion about sort of about the the the the usage currently right now because some of these lanes are used as like sort of everybody's backyard in the neighborhood where kids are riding bikes and it's very low traffic and and you know they kind of use it as like a quasi park in a way ball hockey etc and with more I've heard the argument about more eyes in the street and that that's I think that it's valid but what about the impact to people sort of used it the way they use it today has that been considered and what have you heard and you know I mean because I I have had questions about that yes I think laneways sweets can contribute positively to the way that communities use laneways know that of course having more people you know eyes on the laneway having more activation of the laneway can be a positive thing certainly you reference that in describing some some lanes I think this will contribute to that so you and and and I imagine safety as well I suppose if there's the eyes directly on yes but what about the the adverse effect that some have suggested is there any do you believe there's any merit in their in their concern or is it just a worry or is there something real there which specific adverse effect one that I just described currently it's sort of you also your time is up let's get the councillor an answer yes I do in my view laneway housing will contribute positively to the environment on laneways Suites generally so I I don't know that I necessarily agree that there are more you don't you disagree with them correctly okay thank you both any other members with questions for staff we're gonna yes oh sorry counselor Fletcher thank you I just wondered about [Music] one of the deficits I think from Harvard Village indicated and maybe this has been answered but I didn't get it quite clearly that there were a number of changes that hadn't been anticipated or that they found when they reviewed this document which wasn't available wasn't available last week was it was it available a week before the meeting let me put that yeah so the some of the changes noted by the deputy from Harvard Village were contained in the staff report specifically the change of proposed permitted laneway suite depth from 8 to 10 meters and a few other changes those were detailed in the staff report and those changes were made following our most recent community meeting the the doctor yes those were made public along with the report the document that was posted last night was the zone was some changes to the zoning bylaw that's again in my view were more for clarification and are not material to the intent of permitting laneway Suites they were provided for clarification really in an effort to address some of the comments we received from the killer you're saying that that 8 to 10 8 by 8 to 8 by 10 was in a report that was published I'm just interested in when the question is when it was on the agenda it was on the agenda when it was published there was Ron the agenda published last week okay correct I just want to be clear on the see of a entries which we've gone over and over again we've had a report here I'd come to understand that the OMB and T lab have jurisdiction over a tree in a planning matter am I correct final decision rests there if it's shown on a plan like a site plan and they make a decision that approves yeah building on that site planned and yes right so if you have a building and you go to the OMB or you go to the C of a and it shows that you have to take out a tree that's a private tree the C of a can make a decision an approve your site plan and approve the removal of any tree in the city that's on private land that correct yes the CV it's the tribunal but yes the tribunal if you appeal it that's correct so there's a the city forestry actually has limited jurisdiction when it comes to a planning matter over trees because the OMB and the tea lab have the final say if it's a site plan application that's been appealed I think I'm right on that one I just want to know about the issue around our laneways and we're looking at the state of good repair so would we be would it be right to think that if we could prior i's lane ways for state of good repair repair that would have a laneway house so if we're going to introduce homes which i think is a great idea if we get this right as one of the deputies said i'm going to expect that those lane ways are going to working out with some budget there to make sure that they're not living on the pothole ridden things that are all throughout my ward I'm sure that's directed to me yes madam chair it would be one fact that we would look at first state of good repair we know that some of our lane ways aren't in great shape we'd have to increase our transportation budget would you it would be necessary yes I believe so would you be able to let us know there's hundred applications now that are in for a laneway how people say they're ready so on those lanes can we make sure that number one they're going to be good and number two it's not taking from street somewhere that we are able to ensure there's enough of a budget to bring those up to a standard that one would expect on a street that has a house I think we'd have to review the lanes on a case-by-case basis and see where the applications are so we could ask you to transfer to actually comment on that in a month there are guests basically I just wanted to know about the impact of affordability because I read recently in the globe that this is while we're looking at making these affordable and affordabl people to move into that there has been an overall impact I understand on general house prices in those neighborhoods so that houses the whole prices of whole neighborhoods have gone up because of the introduction does anyone know anything about that from the real estate market is that been something you've looked at no not currently we I don't think we have that data specifically I don't know if Shawn wants to comment on affordability at all but not about the affordability of the units it's about the impact overall on assessed value and entry level etc for this nature of this housing not adding a third floor whatever if that might be possible to find out a little bit more it could have been wrong but I thought that was interesting we should be planning for that last question and I guess I guess I'm done I don't need to ask nothing thank you okay thank you very much councillor any other councillor too interested in asking staff questions okay councillor McMahon thank you very much I just said because councillor SEO he's not here but he had a motion with some items in it that he was going to move and I'm not sure if he I think he's spoken to you about some of the items I just wanted to kind of go through them with you there yes caseware McMahon would you like to ask those questions once the the motion is actually moved so we can all be aware of what you're asking questions about well okay well this yeah I guess first of all the first one is about affordability and was this ever the goal that laneways sweets would solve the affordability issue in the City of Toronto no I don't believe that was the intent at the outset of the study and and what was the intent then the intents of the changing lanes initiative was to provide a framework that would allow the construction of a new type of rental units in established neighborhoods that represented a different size and form than what currently exists to provide an additional option of rental accommodation okay and you feel that this proposal does that this report does that yes and you've had extensive consultation across the city just to solicit ideas in my opinion yes and what do you feel there's been overwhelming support or there hasn't been there's been a lot of opposition or to clarify my previous answer the consultations took place in Toronto and East New York primarily and we heard generally positive there was a mix of opinions that were provided over the course of the project but it was a generally positive reception to what we were proposing in the direction that we were headed what about the mechanical equipment associated with the laneway Suites so there's been some questions about where it should be situated and the permitted projections that are proposed for things like mechanical equipment in the zoning bylaw are believe the same it's not very similar to what is permitted currently for a house in a residential area there's also an opportunity for the basement to accommodate a furnace or other mechanical equipment it might be necessary in a laneway suite and with regard to your outreach so you have Eve outreach to the residents and you've also outreach to the councillors right that's correct and you had individual sit-down meetings with every councillor way back in the day we extended the opportunity to meet we ended up meeting with a number of councillors in the study area okay and then councillors were invited to the consultations that's correct and it's my understanding that you have been emailing the counselors to update them on on what where you're at in the report at key milestones we updated counselors offices along with the RAS via email okay thank you thank you very much counselor with the man any other counselors final call for counselors to question counselor by Lao I just want to make sure make sure I understood correctly you said that there were no changes that were made public only yesterday that all the changes that the changes that came after the community consultation were part of the report the changes that we made following the consultation were included in the report the document that was published last night were technical amendments to the bylaw that was previously published with the staff report for the intent of clarity okay and can if if I I build a garage and I need a variance from my garage do I have to ask for a rezoning process or can I just go to committee of adjustment typically that would be considered through a committee of adjustment application so today there's something that is as of right to build my garage and I have the right to go to committee of adjustment and ask for variance for that correct yes so what we're saying here is we're creating guidelines as a right to have this these suites and if there's variances we're suggesting that they go to committee of adjustment exactly the same process that we use for cars today we're going to use for people in the future is that correct that's correct okay did you do shadow studies privacy impact as you're developing the guidelines in collaboration with our urban design staff on the team we modeled various options for laneway suite designs on the site we had to look at shadow Overlook and other impacts yes and can you report on the the setbacks and the power in maintaining green space because I thought that in certain circumstances we are actually doing better that our current standards require can you explain that a little bit more we we can certainly provide more information to that affect the way that we attempted to the intent of the the zoning bylaw is to not diminish the amount of green space on these Lots so to require really the majority of space between a house and a laneway suite as well as space within the laneway setback to be green space in the bottle off so that that's that's what we're we we intend with this bylaw and that's what we all have in front of us that's the intent yes again we'll take a look in light of the comments raised to ensure that anybody loved it that it's clear counsel that is clear and that it represents the intent of the report okay how many families live in our city today and secondary units last question I don't have that information available but I can certainly look into it and provide a link somebody does through the chair as part of our census data and looking at demographics in the city we estimate there's anywhere between seventy to ninety thousand renters with in secondary dwelling units thank you okay thank you very much I think that brings us to the end of any counselors with questions counselors to speak so far I have councillor Muhammad counselor Layton councillor fridge' Dukakis now councillor perks councillor Barlow councillor McMahon councillor by Lao I'm sure you'd like to speak yep okay councillor Krusty you are number three anyone else okay and then I'll add myself at the end I'll be your sweep okay counselor my USB capture I think I've caught it I think there's gonna be a series of amendment and what has what the advice I've received from from from clerks is that you can all table and they will we will sort it out do one big pile of soup not pile of pot of soup so I'm a little tired and I'm just eating my breakfast and lunch right now sorry sorry folks okay so counselor my havoc you've got five minutes take less time if you'd need it's okay but and as much as five of you smoking so much let me say this madam Speaker I'm now trying to be as brief as I can but I do have a fairly long motion maybe I should present it first there it is I'll go through it first thing though I want to do is say thank you to counselor by law counselor McMahon for prodding us to think about laneways sweets in a different kind of way than we have historically I think it is a good initiative I really really really really do and I want to find a way to to support it thank you to staff as well for under undertaking the negotiations and to community and groups that that have provided input I do think that laneways sweets will provide animation to laneways will increase safety there's nothing like living on a laneway to basically have that laneway look cleaner if nothing else they'll pick stuff up that is sometimes phantom ly dumped I think it will help local retailing and I think it will reduce a car dependency but mostly and this is what the very first speaker George spoke to was that it will allow us a different form of housing there are so many folks that have come to me saying and you know what I'll use myself as an example if we had laneway housing right now my parents would be who are 95 years old would be living in the in that in that unit they live way too far I want to keep them under my watchful eye but they can't because we don't have this possibility if you go to every city every continent on this planet probably saved North America multi-generational an extended family dwelling is the norm and has been the norm for us as a species forever and ever whereas we've gone indirect in the direction of nuclear rising and creating smaller and smaller family units this allows us to say you know what we can have a little bit of a wall whatever not compound but we can provide more housing opportunities for extended families in one site that I think is the big sociology of what this proposal does so I am supportive and in fact one of the motion says not only am i supportive but you know what we really need to get on to Phase two which is to look at not just lean way housing but for those Lots where it is appropriate to say we want it there as well so that's that's the first point the second point is and you know from some of the questions I hope people do not take offense to a deferral we do it all the time this is our second crack at it we want to get this right because if you don't get it right there'll be all kinds of Appeals and you're gonna get the calls we're gonna get the calls we're all gonna get the calls of how this is not working so we got to get it right as right as possible so waiting a month or two months whatever the timeline is to get it right I think is a worthwhile investment one of the other speakers are former city councilors seat ramp cloud saying I had made exactly the same point the devil is in the details the devil is in the details for me the big devil and it was promised at the beginning there were a lot of speeches made on how this is going to help with affordability well then let's make sure that it helps with the affordability by both by both perhaps and I've had the opportunity to talk with mr. Gannon with the program that the city offers and also in my humble opinion I can't see why if it's gonna be your family you're not charging rent if it's not going to be your family why can't we have a list of properties and say if if you are on that list and if you are renting then it has to be 80 percent 90 percent whatever it is of the CMHC average why can't that be in a city that is absolutely desperate and we need to use not one tool not two tools but 10 tools to increase the availability of affordable housing we need to do this we need to find a way to introduce strong affordability mechanisms in this in this project it is better to go a little stricter at the beginning and loosen up later than to just leave it wide open and pretend that the market is going to solve all our issues the rest of the motions there are things that people have mentioned deputies have mentioned I would note that we're the downtown Community Council today in about six months we're not going to be the downtown Community Council there might be two downtown community councils so I think we want to with the new council after the elections we want to give some consideration to how we basically figure that that piece out we can ask staff to do that in the next month as well thank you very much councillor there are questions councillor pilo just a couple questions on the zoning so one of the things that we kept hearing from people that built units and was the expensive process associated with these kinds of units and that's why only people with a lot of money or an architect or planner builds laneways Suites or houses right now houses in ours in our city so we try to bring this to become more available the same way like I said like I asked staff we have garages that we weed we can build a 5 meter high garage we go for a variance right why would we have that process if we want to have a 5 meter garage which is outside our variants are by law but right now we can build a 4 meter height garage and if you want a variance to that you go to committee of adjustments so why are we requesting people to enter into a complete rezoning process frankly that that was a reporter question I think we want to consider that you know these are four considerations and you want to hear what staff have to say about I haven't landed on the on that on that myself on that piece I'm faithfully trying to combine some of the things that other people have said I think there might be some merit for the first year so that we establish some patterns to take it bring it here so that we know you know when to allow a variances from the bylaw so maybe for the pilot we go council community council and then take it to committee of adjustment there's a lot of ways to think that thing through but I think we want to walk before we run so I'm not fixated on that right now okay and what is the goal of limited the GFA so we have already all kind of its to note the gfa oh so it's several if I if I have a laneways suite and that in in right now it's not included in the calculation and I want to build a an additional floor on and I want all kinds of variances for that I already have the laneway sometimes that's a bit much so I think the committee of adjustments should at least have that noted that on that piece I think it should at least know that you also have a laneway suite and that you know this is not an intent to preclude that from being an added no but I think it should be well I think it should be part of the calculation and if it's separated out whatever I don't really care how it's done but it should every committee of adjustment application that includes a laneway suite should have a notation that that it's you know 1.0 coverage but to point to all of it is a laneway suite sorry my apologies questions have concluded oh I do see you counselor Layton please go ahead thank you very much just further to that to that point around this 3a because you say it's to note it that's not the language that's in the motion at least the one that the clerk's just printed for me it says include the density of annually suite in the calculation of density GFA of the property which would to me suggest that it's when the planners are doing their review of a committee of adjustment application or the planning examiner is doing the PPR that they're gonna say we'll take the square footage just like basements were recently added they would just add this in and all of a sudden a point one density increase because they add in the gfa of the of the laneway suite all of a sudden ends up of 0.5 and that that it wouldn't be teased out and and maybe this is something that we can have when when those that are reporting back can take note that the intent is not to have it added in fully I would just worry it doesn't say note well it's it's just report back on in the way I would see it happening is so if it's as of right that size of right so I put a laneway unit in the back of my I don't have a laneway by the way but I just use this as an example where your where your parents going to stay that I'm going if if I had a laneway it would be as of right but then if I wanted to make an addition onto my home then density considerations come into play and I would think that a committee of adjustment would want to know that that if you have if you're going from point A to one point zero plus you've already got the benefit of a laneway unit that that's important information for that or I I get I get I completely understand the intent and I think that that that is a reasonable request it's just as I don't see that the language is reflected here but it is for report back so given that this isn't changing the bylaw perhaps that the planners could take that into consideration thank you thank you thank you very much councillor Layden speaker any other questioners no okay so next person to speak is councillor lately thank you very much and thank you to staff and for councillors McMahon and and by Lao for for pushing this to this point I I in in my community most most streets have Lane ways I think I can probably count the number of streets that don't I know because I can't remove street parking on those streets to put bike lanes because they don't have any parking but at the rear although I haven't yet there are there are a few streets that that don't in fact the the lane way that I back on to also has Lane way housing on it already from a pre-existing condition where there was a garment washing factory that got flipped into into a row of townhomes for that reason when when I knew this was coming I did a little investigating on whether or not it was possible on where I live and the reality is it is it's a it's an ideal candidate from probably from any measure but unfortunately the cost is like enormous ly prohibitive in particular to run the utilities and so when we did our number crunching in my household irrespective of what came out of this we kind of just said is this can't have it like even if the little bit off in DC's are gonna get us the Delta that we need to make it work as a nanny suite which is what we were thinking as as as my my parents age or as my partner's parents age really whoever needs it first will get in there at one point in time it was councilor Crecy that was gonna move in it we talked about it but the reality is are our finances wouldn't be able to do it to accommodate that not to say that it's the same if for every household but that speaks to just I think one important clarification and I did go back to the original letter that councillor Barlow and McMahon put for it and it didn't reference affordability and I think that's important to acknowledge although we have heard it a lot and we can't we can't ignore the fact that it continues to come up but but this will probably do very little beyond adding a little bit of housing to the rental housing to the market a little bit I say that because after again in ideal circumstances at my own prop and my own home where all the stars were aligned we don't own a car it's a two-car garage so it should work it's just unaffordable that being said if people choose to I think there are some some some considerations that need to come with the evaluation lighting and and and and pedestrian safety for individuals in the laneway monitoring and enforcing the hardscape component these are things that are very real and the activities of a people's day-to-day lives that need to be addressed and they're there not to this point fortunately laneway project is also doing some langley lighting in in ward 19 and in word 18 i believe and this is another one of those projects that could that could activate laneways and make them a safer place to be and more accessible place on the on the referral i think some of these are very very minor in nature i certainly wouldn't take it as take offense to it as if I were the planner that wrote wrote it or those that were driving it forward it's just sometimes there needs to be a second look that's why we're here if we weren't then we would just issue Greg and Linda a giant rubber stamp and they'd get the pass all the bylaws that they wished with that rubber stamp I'm sure they might like that that's not the case in our in our democracy and and and there are things that we identify as counselors that are valid points that we should have the ability to to work into bylaws sometimes it can be a good thing a couple on here that that concerned me and and I should state quite clearly that I will support the recommendations I support these recommendations and I will support them when they come back if if it gets if it gets deferred the two on this list though that that that they piqued my attention a little bit and I'm very conscious of the language that it's just to report back and not give direction to change it one beingness to change the as of right zoning permissions through a zoning bylaw instead of a minor variance I do think that sometimes there are there are instances where a little a little thing doesn't work here they're in a site-specific nature and that the committee can be a good tool for that and then the second is is this very specifically including the GF a density on projects I think that that that that's a complication that we probably don't need given that most houses within within my ward at least are quite a bit over the stated an allowable gf a because of historic additions to the rear and as second floor additions that they just far exceed the point 7 or 0.8 that the the point 6 that a lot of these lots are I know that because we also identified putting a third-story on as the nanny suite which is also prohibitively expensive for for us so we just won't do anything but but the language in this referral is quite clear it's - it's to examine it I'm still debating whether or not I should pull those out just to vote against them so it was it's clear to the public and I'm not spoiling thank you thank you very much councillor Leighton councillor fracas thanks very much madam chair I have a motion they could put up on the screen and it's that it amends councillor my Havoc's motion and adds the following instructions and it's that we request the acting director of City Planning for this district to report to the June meeting on an update of the second units a draft opie amendment public consultation meeting that's going to be held next week across the city as the city is holding like I said consultations on second units across the entire city and we're being asked today or we were being asked today to consider carving out a piece of the city and introducing changes in one district on a particular kind of second unit personally I would have preferred that we looked at all second units across the whole city I would have thought that that would be a better way to conduct this to conduct this process however that's not how it's happened so I was a little surprised last week that when I got the agenda for Toronto kneestr community kilns that this item was on it and then in the same breath received an email from the Planning Department about this public consultation that is going to be taking place from May 7th to May 10th across the entire city to get people's thoughts on second units so anyways that's my amendment I in reading some of the some of the specifics of this report you know around on page 25 it talks about building heights where the some of these Suites could be six meters tall that the length of some of these Suites could be ten meters long I'm wondering what kind of backyard is going to be left when you already have a house on that lot that is covering a lot of the property and given the price of real estate in this city most people that are going to the committee of adjustment at least in my area that I have observed are basically trying to cover the entire lot from line to line that's what I've been seeing in my area I don't know what you colleagues have been seeing in your area so because of real estate prices that's what we're experiencing and so introducing this new aspect that is a bit of an over development of the site in my mind and perhaps in the minds of others and that in the community that I currently represent but that come to the committee of adjustment to speak to what they perceive to be the overdevelopment of the site this might be part of that but I guess we'll see next month when you when we come back with some more answers and the other thing that I was particularly interested in is the page 26 comments around parking and that no parking spaces will be required on a lot that includes a laneway suite and so that's in areas where we have parking that is so coveted and we don't have enough of it and we have yet to develop an app some kind of application that lets you drive home fold up your car put it in your pocket walk into your house and carry on with your life we actually have some really serious issues in the Toronto nice jerk district as it relates to parking so I'm concerned about that and I know I speak for the people that I represent around that because we actually had a permit a permit parking consultation in in the easter-egg Civic Center on the 23rd of April and many people have been writing in to me with their concerns around parking issues so this is a little troubling if we're going to be potentially stripping away parking requirements on on sites and then wondering where people are going to park in areas where some of the streets are and some of the permit areas are at a hundred and ten percent capacity and people are wait-listed so those are just some of the concerns that I have I look forward to seeing this again in June I look forward to hearing what comes out of the consultations that staff are going to be hosting across the city next week and hope I have an opportunity to pop by on Monday evening to Metro Hall to to hear from from folks and and see where this goes thank you very much councillor our next speaker councillor perks thank you very much let me begin by saying that I'm not going to support deferring this item I think it's time we got this done on a few of the items that have been raised today first let's get let's dispense with the red herring of affordability this has nothing to do with affordability never had anything to do with affordability these will be either mid rent or luxury units I mean my god a separate detached dwelling at grade in a stable neighborhood in the City of Toronto is not going to rent for the average rent in the City of Toronto it's going to go for a lot more than that ident I can afford one B so this has nothing to do with affordability however some members of council believe that we should be looking at programs to support getting affordability in a range of building types and that's important and and that's a great thing but the way deferral is not the way to get you to that I would ask you to look at recommendations number seven in the report in front of you it directs the general manager or sorry I forget your title all the time Shawn direct Shawn to go look to go look housings are Gatton to go look at laneway housing as part of the Housing Opportunity ten-year review that's due to happen next year so just as we will be looking at whether rooming houses are part of our strategy whether expanding coops is part of our strategy whether the city buying land is part of our strategy we will be looking at laneway houses to see if they can fit into our housing affordability strategy and if it makes sense fiscally for the city to try to incent that portion of the housing market to be where we put our egg our affordability eggs or does it make sense to go somewhere else so there's no reason to defer this to find out anything about affordability we want to do that as part of an overall strategy what this does do though is answer a dilemma that I think is in front of the City of Toronto the dilemma is foundational to how Canadians think of themselves we've always told ourselves that to be middle-class you have to own your own home and we're discovering in the city of Toronto that's not possible we can't provide a detached home for everybody who aspires to be part of the middle class and wants to live in the City of Toronto it's just not possible and in fact we're gonna become more like many large cities in the world particularly those in Europe where the middle class lives in rental housing or some form of social housing co-ops not-for-profits government provided affordable housing this is actually to my mind the key to what this issue is this is the City of Toronto recognizing that people with reasonable incomes or complicated family arrangements and who consider themselves in class are not going to all be homeowners in the City of Toronto that's actually the essence of what's in front of us now that's actually the the dilemma we're dealing with now we've heard a lot about existing policy and our official plan and so on and so forth and yes there was a specific exclusion for this but our official plan specifically states that within our stable neighborhoods we want to see some population growth as long as it reinforces the existing character in my word I'm forever having to explain to people that yes a four-story apartment style building inside a neighborhood is good planning it's good for the neighborhood we're seeing actually in some of our are stable residential neighborhoods we're seeing population shrink because we're not finding more solutions like laneway housing because we're not telling people who live in our neighborhoods yes a four-story walk-up is a fantastic attribute in a neighborhood we're not telling people towns are good Sammis are good laneway housing is good this is part of what makes a vibrant neighborhood particularly in the downtown where we already have some of that I am concerned about the trees and I understand councillor McMahon is going to be moving a motion asking staff to clarify that we can prevent an as of right lane way house going in if the Builder can't find a way to do it without demolishing or without destroying or injuring a healthy mature a healthy tree I want that I want that one locked down I expect to see it by council if this makes it to Council those are my comments but I really think you know let's not get distracted about this being something else this is about the the future of the City of Toronto where we're going to live in all kinds of different arrangements where we're gonna live in all kinds of different forms and where we haven't shrink-wrapped our neighborhoods and said send all the development to Liberty Village and Eglinton and young and King Spadina thank you very much thank you well Church and church and young Cordura but yes who's counting thank you very much for those comments our next speaker councillor van LOH I have a motion with the expectation that there is a referral motion but this isn't the motion essentially I I believe that it's important for us to have information back to see how we can better ensure and this is by the way material to this debate but it's an overall concern that I think all of a shair who care about the the security tenants should have no matter where they are no matter what they live in throughout our city I've significant concerns that under existing provincial legislation there are two to standards that that tenants live under you know one if you live in a building with more than six units you have a number of protections under the RTA if you live in a building that has fewer than six dwelling units the city can't prohibit or regulates demolition or conversion and it's not just the fact that the city can't regulate or prohibit demolition or conversion if you are if you are living in in a building a small building with few units and even the threat of the possibility that you could be subject to your landlord deciding just to move you out in that way means that then you don't even have the confidence that you can defend the rights that you have and I've heard too many stories like that throughout the city so currently even without laneway housing we're already losing affordable apart and apartments in general better under that are that are in buildings that are under six units and I don't want to see us make more shouldn't put it as more mistakes but I just want to make sure that we're going into this with our eyes open to ensure that we do our due diligence and do everything we can to work with the provincial government to make sure that any existing buildings have those protections for those tenants but also if we are going to move in this direction and incent and and create more opportunity for small building types that will have fewer than six units that we recognize that this is a priority that we want these tenants to have protections and that's why I'm moving this motion I hope that we asked for that information and come back I want to make it very clear this in no way enables or disables or impedes or any you know it's not about it's not about that it's about whatever we do we need to make sure that this is a priority and I and I've been asking for this regardless of this debate frankly on this debate I'll speak very briefly to it I actually think this was a incredibly thoughtful conversation that we've had today and I recognize that you know councillors by Lao and McMahon have passionately worked on this and they really care about this as a priority that they've been working on and they've worked with a lot of other people including evergreen and and and a number of other organizations that do remarkable work and contribute to her City all the time and that's why I totally understand that when you are when you love what you have done and you believe in it strongly that just the idea of people coming and saying wait a sec there's a whole bunch of problems where we want to do anything deposit is is can go anywhere from frustration to to being hurtful because you deeply care about what you're doing equally though there are people and I've heard from you know councilor REM calvin singh and ms dexter and others who who are our city builders who like who are not the types who just come and say no to things they they're always saying like how do we make things work how do we solve things like that these are people who are hearing from who are expressing some I think genuine and sincere concerns about specific issues that they're not saying they want to work on to stop they're just saying they want to work on to resolve and so I would submit to us all that that that that that sweet spot is councillor McMahon was was referring to earlier is not so much about finding something that everybody has something to be upset about so therefore I know you didn't mean to say that way but you know so therefore you found the right answer but actually if we have a moment here just a moment to work together to resolve as many issues as possible then actually the sweet spot is is resolution and finding something that people feel genuinely comfortable moving forward with and I and that's what I'm hearing from everyone today so I think you know councillor crises potential requests to work together to achieve that I think is very reasonable it doesn't stop anything it actually helps them move forward in the right way thank you very much councillor our next speaker is councillor McMahon thank you very much and I have a motion that I am going to charm you into supporting instead of councillor Havoc's and that is if you'd like some time we will give you time absolutely we want to get this right and get it right the first time and so let's move the report to Council and without recommendations so we can work on on the things that you are not that your questions about and and concerns about and also we are addressing which came out primarily today was we wanted more clarity on the lot coverage the density and the landscaping primarily the trees so there you have it for that I'm I'm gonna take Gord Downey's lyrics and say this has been a long time coming I can't sing that but it actually has been we've been asking for this and talking about this actually prior to me getting elected this was obviously brought forward but we've been working on it since four years but I've been asking about it from planning and it was always know well not now and whatnot and here we are like how great is this day actually so close to to adopting a laneway sweets policy for the City of Toronto long overdue for sure and I want to just give a shout out to to City Planning and the work they've done George and Greg primarily I need to go on a Hawaiian getaway in an hour really but you're gonna have to wait a little longer landscape and evergreen have been working hard as as have all the residents of cha know as they come out to all these community consultations I'll tell you they're not the usual people who come out well who we saw at these workshops and walks and and presentations and consultations they're totally they are some of the the usual people who come out which is great and then there were a ton of new people who had never come out to something before but this is really important to them because they want to stay in their homes they want to age in place they want intergenerational living they want what what Lanie Suites offers so I'd say with the deferral you know it's tight timing we got a million things to do before we recess in July and I think we can work together to to sort out what's missing before council and you know what yeah you don't take things personally in this place but it is a little frustrating to hear just before new and today that all of a sudden there's gonna be a deferral when you know we're all around to have the conversation well ahead of Community Council but this is the closest we've ever been it's the most creative and innovative housing option I think we it's been before us and city builders want us to be bold and residents want us to make a decision so let's do it okay thank you very much councillor any questions of the mover okay our next speaker is councillor by though okay thank you I I want to start by thanking staff and and the thousands of people that actually have spoken on this issue and got involved from the residents associations to people that have just responded to emails and senders letters so thank you it's been an interesting conversation that the city has been having and that other cities have had for a long time I mean Vancouver's had this for 10 years Ottawa's had other cities has had it so we're not being that bold to be honest with you by having this conversation today we're not being that innovative I think it's about time and that is why I can't support a deferral because as I look to this motion I don't see anything in this motion that can't be deal dealt with from now to council I honestly can't what I respect a lot of the concerns that were brought in here I think that we do this all the time we bring in the stakeholders we bring in the residents associations we bring in the councillors and we have the conversations and we have three weeks to have these conversations and and there's probably going to be some stuff that you know we're gonna have to agree to disagree but two things we need to make sure that yes that we acknowledge these concerns and that's why I think we need to have this conversations and we have three weeks to have them but also to make sure that we're not trying to create a feel-good policy I have this term for the feel-good policies those policies that people can say that they pass laneway housing but they will not produce one Lane Lane where housing in the city because you kill it with a thousand cuts and so as we make sure that we are passing this policy we need to make sure at the practical side of it with all due respect you know the same way that people were asking for rooftops and not having the angular place we're trying to find that middle ground that middle ground that is actually good planning that I think our staff have put in front of us and and that's why I will not support this this deferral I want to pick up on something that that councillor perk said because I think he was brilliant on what what he said when I came to Canada I I came to the area that I represented today and I and in my area to be honest with you I can't remember people not having two and three families living in there I was shocked because I walked into my house I went up the stairs and there there wasn't even a door dividing my family home from the neighbor downstairs they called that a flat right that's what that what we had it was a blue-collar neighborhood that we had right now what is happening is people buy the homes million-dollar homes gentrification comes and off we go this is about the missing middle missing middle in terms of physical but also missing middle about that people that are being pushed out from these neighborhoods that they might choose to rent they might not afford but they might choose to rent they might be able to you know go move into their parents house because their parents still won't in there but they won't be able to buy a housing in my neighborhood even though their parents live there and so if they have the opportunity to do this it they might be able to live in there this is about acknowledging that we have challenges in front of us and that we need to think differently we need to think outside of the box that the house with the car in front of the house the big garage the big three room house it's not going to fit our society this is what we're talking about it's it's it's so you know it's it's it's not only about the laneway housing they over looking over my this is and the affordability no this is about us embracing this concept and that's why so many Urbanists are saying get on with this it's not that it's gonna build thousands and thousands and thousands of units but it's about time the City of Toronto gives a sign to the to to people out there that were ready to embrace this that we're ready to take a step and to have these difficult conversations and and to move forward and to say you know what we're gonna have to do things a bit differently in here and so that's why I think that we we have to acknowledge people's concerns we have three weeks and that's why I think we can do it from now until Council and move on with us thank you very much counselor counselor Chrissie to speak Thank You chair so 2006 was the last time that City Council considered in a fulsome way laneways so eighteen years ago City Council at the time said no - laneway housing without a rezoning okay I without a rezoning so that it's a rather significant important and worth noting change over the course of 18 years that we've now seen here and in that light I think it's worth I would start off by thanking councillors McMahon and by Lao for for pushing the issue forward to the city planning staff and across many divisions for their exemplary work from walkabouts with residents in my community to consultations to one-on-one briefings I want to thank them in single out Greg EWTN's and to the many many many residents and stakeholders who've been part of that and I would say on this basis that after 18 years we're almost there laneways are and I believe this certainly in the old city of Toronto the tty CC but across the city a tremendous untapped resource for the City of Toronto if I could talk just about my ward and ward 20 I with a couple examples rush Lane where Rick Mercer does his rant we currently have a rush Lane pilot project that we've initiated with the local BIA and the residents association to transform that Lane into a cultural space with new lighting opening up patios on the back and embracing the graffiti in here on Sussex just today earlier this morning we approved - laneway houses through a rezoning in here on Sussex as part of a comprehensive neighbourhood plan and housing strategy and in the Harvard Village area we've had a greening plan and um it's working on Croft Lane way for years and so laneways can become so much more and that includes housing so the principles for me as I'm approaching this debate here on the housing context is who are we designing our neighbourhoods for I'll build on counselor by Lau's comments here in terms of who we're designing them for but how I think we can do a better job in this our established neighborhoods of which I was privileged to grow up in one and live in one today can handle more intensification and they can in large part because our neighbourhoods are changing many of the single-family housing units houses I see today we're former rooming houses or former multi-dwelling units in our neighborhoods despite our best efforts through basement apartments and others can do more to ensure that we have a diverse housing stock in our areas - the support to support diverse incomes whether that's rooming houses walk ups or laneway houses I think that's an important part but here's the thing with established neighborhoods given the exceptionally scarce supply of low-rise housing which is exceptionally scarce we have to do everything we can as a city when we consider who we designed the intensification for to ensure that there are a mixture of incomes just as in the 60s and 70s when we purchased through city home houses in established neighborhoods to ensure that they were mixed income as we look to develop an as of right joning permission for laneway housing we must do it now to ensure that we are designing this yes for the missing middle but also for those who can't afford what will be above market rent rental properties because as councilor perc said make no mistake these will be above market rent now that's not to say we don't need low rise above market rent properties we do we do but in this moment right now let us make sure that we do everything we can after 18 years to ensure that if there is 12 years sorry 12 years I apologize to you thank you but let's make sure that we do everything we can because if there is a way that we can approve as of right housing in our laneways with increased measures for affordability why on earth would we not do that when we have a poultry objective of a thousand new affordable housing units a year in a waiting list of 181 thousand units I'm not prepared to say after 12 years of waiting let's pass this today if we can wait a month to see if we can add to that stock and so it's for that reason that I am one of as of right lane way housing I am and I want to get this done this term but - I also support councilor may have experienced delays to improve our opportunity to ensure we have both as of right but a stronger commitment on the affordability side than I want to do that and I think it's worth the wait thank you thank you very much councillor Krusty I'm gonna bump myself and allow councillor Davis and then councillor flexure to speak anyone else okay counselor Davis go ahead Thank You chair I will be supporting the deferral and I'm sure based on some of the questions that I raised during the question period I still want to make sure as many others have said that we have this right what we're about to do is give as of right joning that means your neighbors will not get notice neighbors will not have any right to comment it means that that particular new house behind a house is going to go in without any process that neighbors can engage in and I know there'll be people say yeah that's good and people are calling it streamlining and various other using various other terminology but it is a big step and I know that well in my ward I don't have a lot of lanes so this is not going to affect our neighborhoods as it will in the downtown area but there are 34,000 Lots that now will instantly have a right to a lane way if this goes through a lane way second suite if this goes through you know at the beginning and I I do I should have started as everyone here to thank our counselor colleagues McMahon and by Lao who have championed this from the beginning and who have worked with an incredibly talented group of young somebody used the word Urbanists I have a 20 year old 25 year old son who I would categorize in in that cohort and they've been very good at having their voices heard I have had concerns about making this as of right without us making sure we have absolutely got it correct because there will not be a process where our neighbors will have a voice so we've got to get it right councilor by Lao said it's just like a garage if it's bigger than a if it's bigger than the zoning allows and you go to committee of adjustment this is not just a garage it will however though offer rental housing in the urban core and you know my 25 year old son who is hoping to live in the downtown because that's the urban environment he likes appreciates his friends are there and he does want to live in that environment and maybe one day he'll be able to afford the rent of one of the secondary Suites downtown but as councilor perks and others have pointed out it will not be affordable and the 33 34 thousand people who have a Lane way lot they won the lottery they will win the lottery when this goes through that means that your properties instantly a higher assessed will instantly be higher assessed value whether you put second suite on it or not because that neighborhood is going to go up in value it is not going to make those properties any more affordable for anyone else to be able to purchase so as we men hack Nuys the downtown core and it's happening of course we will through this approach provide more options for rental housing and that is good but I do believe that the stable residential neighborhoods have been told and expect that they're stable residential neighborhoods are going to stay stable and there is the potential to destabilize our residential neighborhoods and while the official plan says they're stable but not static the potential here is huge for seeing the loss of green space for seeing the character of these neighborhoods change significantly and so I do think we have to get it right I'm not sure these standards are right yet and so I think we well first of all because as someone else pointed out we're all looking at what got changed overnight I'm circling and trying to figure out what was changed councillor your time's up so I think we have to get it right everyone has to understand truly what the Bible I wasn't have this a democratic process where they have a chance to actually familiar their eyes themselves with it get a further report back on clarification counselor frag attacks point out coverage is not - your time is up this is a nice jerk issue for sure and I look forward to engaging in this discussion again next month I think thank you very much councillor Fletcher yes thanks very much I say this is a really big idea whose time has come it is very exciting and I think everyone's worked hard and I as well want to congratulate the councillors the staff the entire community that's been thinking about this and others we've got architects developers people that are thinking and considering how this is going to work in the City of Toronto I have people come up to me all the time that say well I really wanted to put in a laneway house because I my kids I want a place for my children we've heard about Joey wants a place for either his father or himself up there all right and that those are really important personal things for everybody when they're thinking about what are they going to do in this city that gets less and less affordable every day and all of us all residents who have kids realized wow where's your chance to live in the city and but this is like a big development it's this huge development with this big zoning bylaw that's in front of us and those who aren't used to that who have come today I just want to say to you that's how we're thinking about it it's massive it's important if this was a big developer coming in we would want to spend the same time although we have a pressure there that the developer says we're taking you to the OMB and so you better figure it out quickly so as someone said let's get this right and those who have dealt and I'm just gonna say have sue and Sita and others I mean I met first met Sita when she was dealing with the Grange and development in the Grange there are people that have long history of getting development right under tremendous pressure so I don't begrudge any time where we would want to see how we can make this better and look at what the impacts are the same way is these folks that came in front of us for honest teds that come in front of us for the AG oh say what about this this this and this this isn't about do we like these or do we not like these we all like these it's a great idea it's what are the circumstances since we're dealing with an as of right though nning permission that they would be introduced what are the issues that we need to be very thoughtful about and those who have that expertise from the community side not the staff side I've come forward to say here's issues we want you to think about and I think we do have to think about that we'd always come to some kind of compromise or agreement I'm not worried about that I'm not worried about extra time here I'm worried about rushing when we have people very eager to start this and those who have managed and dealt with huge development saying we really want a little bit more time so we get it right I also just want to add that affordable housing is the biggest issue of our day the mayor says that's what he's planning to run on we had a huge Easter Sunday the Easter Friday the night before 130 people about housing affordability inclusionary zoning these are huge issues and so how does this add to affordability and if it doesn't then how do we make sure that people that are modest income middle-class families those who want to have this for their kids for their families and others at a decent rent that we can try to guarantee that that we're not setting up in neighborhoods developers coming in building something and someone renting that out with no social good for adding this into our lien ways I believe we can make it better those kids that wonder where will I live will I ever live in the City of Toronto will I have to move out kids raised born and raised here I think this is very important for that generation and we have to think about them affordability is very important for everybody and taking some extra time does does not bother me and anyone who thinks we're taking extra time in order to somehow turn this back I want to assure you that our job our job here is to be thoughtful and get things right and I appreciate the ability to do that based on all the excellent work that's gone into this to date thank you very much councillor Fletcher there are no other councillors I would like to speak as well and I do have a motion if I can ask the clerk's that put it on the screen and the motion is before you one is to take the correspondence from the ABC residents Association and asked after report back on that the communications portion and an analysis of laneways Suites has constructed on laws with row houses the second part of the motion is to specifically ask for written clarification around the site area specific policies as they perhaps may but up or a complement the secondary plan and in particular Opa 403 that that sort of rests over the the upper area of Yorkville I want to thank the local councillors councillor by Lao and councillor McMahon as well and I have to say I'm a little bit envious largely because I have been a huge supporter of laneway housing and laneway revitalization along commercial streets beyond laneway housing for a number of years actually in 2010 I actually was a very naive young politician and I actually created a series of policies each policy was a position paper from harm reduction safe for injection sites to pedestrianisation of Yonge Street to public banking and so forth including one on laneway housing and laneway commercialization as a facade improvement program I didn't get very far on some of them and I have gotten much further on others so it's actually a fantastic fantastic report that's before us and I embrace it with a lot of enthusiasm I also know the history of 2006 because I actually invited the councillor who initiated that rapport to a conversation with myself and that of course was councillor geum brownie and I asked him what went wrong in 2006 and how do I actually introduce it in 2010 or 2011 and he essentially said to me the City of Toronto would never be able to wrap their heads around it largely because the conversation at that time was led by waste management and and that's because how do we service the the the laneways if they become front yards and front doors if they need to be serviced with garbage trucks and so forth so that was one reason why it didn't go through another one was the severance of Lawton and so forth and so forth so but he really was discouraging of me of even trying to tackle it again I don't think it was he meant to sabotage my enthusiasm per se but he was just cautioning you are going to run up against a hill so hats off to the councillors who ran up against that hill and thank you to the community of Urbanus as well as just citizens who don't even consider themselves urban is for embracing the ideal of laneway housing but really I think we need to thank planning staff and the reason being is because if you were not able to help us get to a yesterday which clearly you've gotten us to a yes not everybody is in agreement that it's the full yes but your were so much closer than we have ever been before I would like to see as a councillor that's ending the term I would like to see this term of Council approved laneway housing with the modification the refinements that are required a neighborhood association that I represent and I believe that they're probably one of the most sophisticated in the city which is the ABC residents Association along with those who appeared before us provided a 12-page letter of technical review and amendments attached to that 12 page letter was an appendix with six pages attached to that was appendix number two with 11 pages and every single one of them was around technical considerations that they wanted a little bit more information and clarity the one thing we did with the tall buildings guideline in the city is that we passed it and there wasn't nearly the same love of review not the same level of energy and certainly not the same level of feedback nor technical feedback as we watch the city intensifying around us I would say one of the things that probably we could have done was add that much more intensity to the review because so much of what was a guideline has been blown up very quickly afterwards because it was left for interpretation so I certainly have no problems making sure that it does get passed in this term and that we do feel that missing middle but it's also important to note that the MIDI missing middle is much more than just laneway housing is about duplexes it's about triplex four-plex multiplex courtyard apartments and so forth so if we're gonna have a conversation about filling that missing middle then we might as well start at some point probably in the new term start thinking about what does as of right for those built forms look like beyond laneway housing now that is going to be a conversation I'll take tremendous courage probably more than laneway housing but nevertheless it's a it's a great very good place to for where we are today but I do think that it requires more refinement but I don't want it to stop and I want the councillors and everyone in the room to hear these remarks is that I want this to be approved this term and I think we can get there but we're gonna have to trust each other that we want to get there together and I've heard that right across the room from all the different councillors thank you very much so now we have to make sense of all these motions so we will begin I believe okay so thank you very much I'm going to so there is going to be a sequencing of the emotions I feel like yeah no this is great yeah you don't have to write it down I'll just let you know what it is councillor Fraser Dacus this motion will be moved will be voted upon first and if the clerk's can just put that on the screen on jog our memory okay all those in favor any opposed okay do you want to record a vote or just let it go okay okay that parrot carries thank you very much our next motion is from Kallstrom a low weight goes on the screen oh okay okay all those in favor any opposed that carries thank you very much the third motion is my own coming onto the screens shortly okay all those in favor any opposed that carries thank you our fourth motion is counts from the Havoc's original motion as now amended by the the three preceding motions and it's the long one so just wait for if if I could just on I guess a question just the clerk's that the motion number to review and reconsider doesn't direct staff to actually change something specific I'm uncomfortable Havoc's motion point to his review and reconsider this is in providing direction to come back with this is a requirement is it can we provide counselor can we provide counselor Leighton and answer how will it be interpreted vice by staff is what you could just ignore point to a or like you could review it and come back and say it's not feasible right the way the way we would interpret it is that you've asked us to look at all of these issues and come back and give you a thank you okay great thank you very much okay so counselor may have exposure is before you and oh then there was a request for a recorded vote yes okay all those in favor indicate your support councillor Davis councillor muhabba councillor Fletcher councillor Krusty councilor wantem councillor fridge' daka's councillor Layton councillor Matt lo those opposed councillor perks counselor troi see councillor McMahon councillor by Lao thank you that carries and there should be one more oh I see I see okay so that now carries will have the opportunity so your ass or councillor McMahon your your motion is ruled as it redundant we will look forward to seeing everybody back in this room in approximately one month hopefully with every single wrinkled ironed out so this is a very positive big step forward thank you very much everyone thank you why don't we just take a two minute recess while we organize the room but don't stray too far we we will lose quorum shortly could we get the members of the Toronto and East your community council back into the committee room please so I believe there are some counselors who interested in clearing some quick items but I also recognize the time it's it's quarter to six I want to make sure every deputymon who's been sitting around all day has a chance to be heard so I'm not going to deal with the quick items right now what I'd like to do is is make sure that the the deputies have an opportunity to be heard which brings us to te thirty two point two zero eighteen to thirty two Eastern Avenue one Khalid place on to Sackville Street official plan and zoning bylaw amendment applications request for directions report we have our first speaker it's been numbered for me here Isaac Tang Isaac welcome we are item twenty twenty your time I'm here representing York condominium corporation three eight nine that's the condominium corporation for the property at 465 King Street East and that's the site that's located immediately north subject property that's being proposed to be developed I'm also presented Katherine Bray and Alan Potts who are owners of unit 20 in that condominium now if there's a case for City Planning to draw the line on what is appropriate in terms of development in Corktown and what is not this would be the case the words in the city's own secondary plan document the King Parliament secondary plan directing where growth is appropriate and where it is not must mean something now we are parties to the local planning Appeal Tribunal the CEO and be hearing we have a pre-hearing conference scheduled on June the 4th we are prepared to support the city should it decide to oppose the proposed development we have party status and we expect to the city be there as a strong ally now I've highlighted the concerns we have in the five-page letter that I've I've sent late last night but I just want to highlight three main concerns the first is that Corktown it's a stable area it's known for its small-scale development and its heritage attributes when you take a look at the second area plan that's prepared for King Parliament small scale is mentioned five times and four times it's in the context of cork town in planning terms the proposed development is designated mixed-use area a cork town it's the SIP this shows right here see cork town is the area highlighted in in yellow all the other areas around it here this area here that area here these are regeneration areas now these are areas targeted for significant growth cork town is not and that is specifically stated in the secondary plan and what I see here also is that when council made its decision that passed the secondary plan it created a boundary it creates a boundary right along this line this is Eastern Avenue the area north of eastern is designated mixed-use area it's supposed to be stable small scale development the other areas south of eastern and essentially west of power slash Parliament is that as interesting I think growth and so our position is that tall buildings which is what is proposed in this case a 12 story building is not appropriate in sell in Corktown now that's self evident in the planning documents itself but we would like to bring council to the ground now Eastern Avenue is a 20 meter right-of-way road what's being proposed is an over 40 meter building and this is the staff report that curiously supports development admits that by definition it's a tall building we're putting a tall building in an environment that's meant to be stable now city staff mentioned that this development is better than the initial proposals always put forward which did not comply with the 45 degree angle plane at all it proposed a 0-0 metre setback to the north and essentially a giant rectangular building that was 12 stories now they've cut it they've shaved the back of the developments they meet the 45-degree angle but in all other instances it's relatively the same development the height is still over 48 meters the scale is basically the same if you're taking a look at it from Eastern it's gonna be the first tall building in Corktown and it's gonna set the ground floor for future developments in this area now this completely undermines the direction the secondary plan that separates core town from the West Don lands over here and Jarvis's Parliament so that's completely contrary to the intent when Council passed on the secondary plan for this the third issue I'd like to raise is just the severe lack of street parking in Corktown now the citizens here have been dealing with under EULA I guess not enough street parking for many many years the last currents this happened was because there's an approval of 90 Trinity right from the northwest corner of Trini Street and Easter now that was approved only with 61 units and 36 parking spaces now what's being composed here is 331 units with only 91 parking spaces so that's less than one parking spot for every three units in an area that's already underserved by parking so the concerns that I'm raising here today they're not new concerns so there are the same concerns that have been raised by community consultation meetings for the development and same concerns raised by the city it's in its own secondary plan now when we're dealing with a conversion from industrial law to residential the secondary plan states that the building should not exceed the height the zoning permits 12 meters they're proposing 46 the density massing the scale must be consistent and reinforced the physical character of the area Altaria is proposing a precedent 12 story condo building your time is up thank you there may be questions for you any questions for the speaker okay seeing none thank you our next speaker on this matter is Katherine Bray Katherine hi you have five minutes the clock is on your left-hand side when you're ready I'll start your clock thank you I'm ready thank you everyone and thank you for your attention after such an interesting debate on the laneway issue my name is Katherine Bray I'm an owner and a resident at your condominium 3 at 9 as Isaac mentioned we are directly north of the proposed development and my unit is the southernmost unit so I'm the one having the pleasure of looking at 12 stories outside my bedroom window this area of cork town is all 2 and 3 stories so this is a shot of King Street going looking eastward you can see the Heritage character you've got little Trinity Church here you know Turner's just down here this is Heritage it's all heritage along King heritage on Trinity heritage on Sackville and we care about that nature the other thing I wanted to show you to give you a sense of the low scale can you see from this all of these buildings are under the 12 meter height the only exception is a little bit off the corner of this and that is 90 Trinity that Isaac mentioned so this at 46 meters is a huge departure from the rest of the character of the area which is Isaac mentioned has been identified as an area of special identity to preserve this special nature we are not against development we understand the city wants to intensify as Isaac mentioned the city has identified areas immediately west and south and we've got West Don lands to the east of us which are undergoing greater intensification but it's inappropriate in this area that the city already made a policy to keep it small grain and lower we have met with the councillor there are different community groups that are meeting with the counselor our community group was residents from Sackville Trinity King Street and our condominium we've met with the Council of twice #NAME? concerns one time if we facilitated with the developer about 12 to 15 residents attending those meetings I also have a petition that we went to remember that cold snap we had in the middle of after Christmas we went out got a hundred and twenty rounds and twenty-one signatures from the immediate streets in Corktown special area all opposing the scale of this development there are approximately a hundred and twenty residences in this cork town area of special identity oh I'm sorry can I ask you to take that down yes thank you very much there's some personal data that we want to apologize that's not publicly seen go ahead please okay there are a hundred and twenty residences in this special area they are special identity area of cork town at 331 residences this building alone will almost be triple the size of the existing residences this is not small grained sensitive introduction of gradual change this is a this will completely change our area and also I think it's interesting with 120 residences we figure about 80 businesses we got 121 signatures two people declined to sign one works with the City of Toronto and felt that it was perhaps inappropriate for them to sign a petition and the other one said they were too busy they couldn't they couldn't talk with us everybody else that we asked signed the petition so as I said we understand that development is going to happen we just think this is just too massive a scale in terms of my residents so this is our condo this is our condo it's a three-story with commercial units at grade and then two-story residential above which actually mimics Tilton in 1970s it actually mimics the heritage buildings in the area which often had a commercial and then a residential up above my particular unit this isn't a particularly attractive picture but I think it shows the point my particular unit is here at the end those that's my sunroom which will now the new development is right here great at this end at the end of the parking lot my sunroom it's got angled windows all across the roof my bedroom my bathroom has angled windows all across the roof we're not talking small windows here these are four by fourteen feet and I've got three sets of them I will now have all these people in this unit looking at me so I'm certainly concerned about privacy I'm concerned about the use of my outdoor deck which interestingly was not on any of the developers materials your final thought please thank you I'm also very concerned about shadowing the impact on the whole condominium and on the neighborhood Park which will now lose at 3 hours of daylight in the mornings all through the winter thank you very much are there any members with questions for the speaker okay seeing none I'd like to call our next speaker Allan pots Allan welcome thank you and thank you for all of you who have been waiting so patiently you'll have five minutes when you're ready okay thank you madam chair and members of community council thank you for allowing me to speak today my name is Allan pots I have been an owner at 465 King Street East for 20 years I'm also the president of our small three-story Corktown condominium York condominium corporation 389 and we're directly north of the proposed development at eighteen thirty two Eastern one Gilead and two Sackville we as was said before by the two previous speakers were in favor of development in our area we live in the city we get it but it's got to be development that too propria as you heard from Isaac the proposed development is completely inappropriate according to the King Parliament secondary plan this massive development is four times the allowable height and will adversely affect our community due to privacy issues shadowing lack of parking noise and excessive street traffic we strongly recommend a ssin to move forward with this development and we ask that City Council rejects the recommendation and direct to city legal to strongly oppose this proposal at the tribunal thank you very much short and sweet and that's been said thank you okay thank you very much any questions of the speaker okay seeing none thank you I would like to call Elizabeth Jones to speak Elizabeth are you here I'm actually speaking for Elizabeth Jones we checked with the clerk oh yeah you have her remarks right have her remarks and I'll read them this Jones is also an owner and business owner landowner business owner and resident at 465 King and she asked me to speak to the development issue that Isaac also referenced so this is Eastern this is King Street this is our condominium this is the proposed development site the sites that are whited out are all surrounding us and those have all been assembled and are ready for development some of them are underutilized with parking some of them are single-story that have been vacant for periods of years and one of our concerns so I'll read from it his any development in historic or town should be small-scale infill developments or building conversions in keeping with the characteristics of the neighborhood this proposal does not the the submission from the developer does not meet these criteria in any way and sets a precedent for future development the white portions as I said are areas that have been assembled that we believe are ready for future development if the proposal goes for for 18 to 32 Eastern we feel that it will just not only in itself will destroy the character of the neighborhood it will set the precedent which will mean that these other sites will then get similarly developed with large-scale tall buildings and we request that you reject the proposal recommendation by planning and that you join us in the appeal at the board thank you thank you very much are there any members with questions seeing none thank you our next speaker is Caroline Lumos Caroline welcome good evening my name is Coraline ulemas and I live at 461 King Street East which is right here and I'm one of the four set of row houses which are actually listed on the city of Toronto's inventory list so within the block of this development I own one of the properties that is on the inventory I been in the area for 37 years I am property owner and business owner okay so regarding this development I find that the massing isn't appropriate the height and the setbacks the setbacks are suggested to be at level 7 I believe they should start at level 3 the last thing I want to speak about is that I was a participant in the initial meeting focused at putting together a workable King Parliament plan that was put together by our deceased councillor Pam economy during that meeting the st. Lawrence Association the Citizens for the Old Town the Corktown Association and the Queen Street East Association would present the outcome of the meeting was that it was important to maintain the low scale framework for future development in order to not take away from the industrial and residential heritage that is included in the area and this includes commercial residential row houses which are on Main Street such as King Street and and row houses that are on side streets and cul-de-sacs to approve this development will go against all that our disease counselor helped to establish thank you thank you very much any questions of the speaker seeing none our next speaker is Peter Naismith Peter welcome excuse me for a ad-hoc speech I wasn't going to speak but in the presence of democracy in action I felt I should I agree with all the previous presenters I'm a resident on Sackville Street an owner from the frightening a long time of 40 years I agree with everything they said precedent is a big one for us I won't go into it any more than that you know what I'm talking about historically same thing it's a big one for us other people have talked to it it's important it's all Toronto on our street we've had meetings talking about what's going to happen one of the biggest problems we have with this development other than height which goes without saying and has also been dealt with before is the loading of all the traffic from this building of 331 units plus the businesses along Eastern Avenue all that traffic is loaded onto a I would say small scale one block long one-way residential commercial street all of it allotted their main entrance is off sackful across the street from a public the longest I think I may be wrong the longest continuously running public school in Toronto inglenook school the entrance is directly across the street from the school if in fact we get multifamily or multi or family residences in this building eventually that school is going to be required there are no schools no new schools in that area so you're potentially going to have a lot of kids wandering up and down where trucks are delivering where garbage is being offload uploaded where cars are coming and going and particularly where ubers and rental cars and everything is all trafficking trafficking excuse me on Sackville Street that is the main thing that I would like to get across today is that for some reason a small residential state or residential commercial street is being loaded with all the traffic when it has frontage on a four-lane city street Eastern Avenue why I don't know obviously there are reasons and we've discussed some of them but we're going to end up with all that traffic on top of which there is no commercial or no public transit on Eastern Avenue all the foot traffic is going to be trout traversing our street up to King Street if King if the King project line for streetcar extends to us it would be great because then that'll reduce it the traffic as well but everything is getting loaded on Sackville Street you judge once criticized me for saying it's just not fair but in this case I don't think it's very fair thank you very much for you two and thank you very much for your deputation are there any questions okay seeing none I'd like to call our final speaker Steven Quincy great welcome Steven I have five minutes Thank You counselors I know it's been a long day and listening to residents complain about development it's not much fun but we would really appreciate your attention and your consideration because we as a neighborhood thing this is really really really important I wrote down some of my comments so forgive me I left my glasses at home my name is Steven Quinny I'm an owner 465 King Street East I live there I'm also a business owner at this property my building sits immediately north of this proposed development residents in this neighborhood are in distress about this proposal and I mean that so much so that many of us have given up our day to be here to talk to you and we've waited because this is really really important the residents of this block of historic cork town asked the councillors to oppose this application on the grounds of its inappropriate scale for this small block the King Street secondary plan was put in place to provide a framework for growth in this neighborhood current zoning as you have heard permits a 12 meter high building this proposal is 46 metres it bulldozes over the secondary plan recommendations for small-scale structures that will respect the history and the scale of our block residents are concerned with the height the mass the increased traffic which believe me is already extremely concerning the impossible parking situation and the shadow impact amongst so many other reasons we've heard talk today about a need for housing in Toronto this block is not big enough nor is there sufficient infrastructure to support the building of this size and a proposal that needs to build a massive building on a small lot because it does not make financial sense otherwise for these developers is not an example of good planning in my opinion and in the opinions of the people who live here we are concerned with the precedent that a building of this size sets for the neighborhood and it's bigger than anything else we have to live with right now we live in a historic neighborhood little Trinity Church the Enoch Turner schoolhouse as well as the remaining worker cottages that define this neighborhood people come here because of this the building would cost shadows across Sackville Park at certain times of the year causing an impact on the precious little green space that we have in this neighborhood we have one tiny park that right now is being renovated and thank you City of Toronto for that I would like to stress that we are not opposed to redevelopment this is a dynamic City but we expect developers to be sensitive to the existing neighborhoods in which they wish to build I bought my property knowing that the city had a plan in place to protect the heritage character of this neighborhood based on the King Street secondary plan the residents of this neighborhood opposed this proposal in the strongest terms and we ask that the city oppose it at the tribunal thank you so much for your attention okay thank you very much for your remarks any questions seeing none thank you final speaker you would like to speak sure we're also gonna get you to a check-in with the clerk's afterwards and make sure we have you on the public record please introduce yourself and you have five minutes great thank you madam chair and members of council my name is Calvin Lantz I'm the lawyer for the applicant and I'm here to speak briefly to members of council firstly to thank staff on the efforts that they've undertaken through the process of this application the staff have been instrumental in conducting meetings that go back as early as 2014 there are meetings in 2016 we had meetings with the community many times we've catalogued them I counted many is 14 to 15 meetings and all between city staff and council so I think the message here is that there's been healthy communication with the community and on behalf of our client we would be interested in continuing those discussions in the event that we can't find a resolution before the hearing that is scheduled to occur I think one thing that needs to be kept in mind is that this is a it is a large site it's an industrial site it's a contaminated site it was formerly cadmium plating so there's an opportunity here to clean the site great work has been done with staff and responding to comments of the community to revise the application it's resulted in the application becoming smaller shorter fewer units increased step backs and and I'd like to go back to a comment that was made by my friend Isaac tang when he said that the developer in response to these comments shaved a little bit off the development but essentially it's the same he said it's shaved a bit but essentially the same and if I can just illustrate what has occurred as a result of the discussions you'll see the demarcation of the 45-degree angle er plane and the loss of a significant amount of density the stepping has occurred just in the interest of time I'm going to flip to another image just to illustrate the kind of Shaving that occurred as a result of input from the city so there's been an effort here in in in a good-faith effort on behalf of our client to respond in a meaningful way to these comments so in closing I would just like to also point out that we have 12% three-bedroom units more than the 10% that's you know usually sought by staff these are going to be larger units in the range of about a thousand square feet so sizeable three-bedroom you and so in closing I would just like to again express our thanks to staff and again to invite the community to carry on with the discussions we have been that have taken place over the number of years that this has been with staff and I'm open to have any questions thank you very much for your remarks are there any questions seeing none okay thank you okay question Dairy plan is so clear about the nature and height and character of the neighborhood I'm a little surprised that your client would come in with such an egregious proposal yes the well our client is there a reason why they would not work within the secondary plan well we we are in in our V is working within the secondary plan and I recognizes a disagreement but there had been a number of pre consultation meetings with staff the original consultation had a much higher building that definitely wasn't in the so yes you brought it down you're trying to say it's in the secondary plan yeah okay thank you thank you very much councillor any other ones when the other house was with questions councillor Davis go ahead in 12 stories yes and the original application was 13 story it was 13 is that what you're saying is a significant reduction well it's a combination of things so it's partly its height partly its drop in unit count there's been the introduction of a number of step backs and setbacks to reduce the you know the impact and also to create a better transition to the north the massing of the buildings been moved closer to Eastern and you know it's I think this is really an example of the the line that you know I'm sure our councils are familiar with which is for something to be compatible it doesn't need to be the same and I believe city staff had been looking at this development in terms of what is a compatible fit and transition you're prepared to however I heard you say to continue to have further discussions yes absolutely yes we have a date we have a date at the the tribunal but absolutely our client is willing to carry on discussions and reduce the size and impact well we I know you you put it out here willing to make further changes I what I was saying is we're prepared to have these discussions and see where they go we're doing the discussions in the context of a positive staff report well we all understand that but we're also all familiar with Corktown yes thank you thank you great Thank You councillor Matt havoc very quickly as I understand it the secondary plan it's not older than 10 15 years something like that yes and that's when 12 meters as a height limit was established and you're going 46 yeah it was 40 40 years secondary forty-year-old second area plan I would get it but if it was analyzed within the last decade or so okay all right thank you that brings you to the end of the question correct okay thank you Thank You Calvin for your questions I don't believe their answer answers I don't believe there any more questions for you let's bring this since I don't believe there are any members from the public members with questions of staff okay counselor troi see thank you madam chair planning can you outline the relevant built form policies in the Official Plan that apply to this site so the through you madam chair the policies it's within an excuse area in the parent official planets with an excuse area which is one of the areas that is expected to absorb growth in the city both both employment and residential growth it is the policies do require transition to areas of different intensity in the parent plan and also there are more performance measures around framing streets and providing appropriate public realm the it is also subject to the King Parliament secondary plan which has some more specific policies still mixed use but King Parliament looks to encourage investment it does speak to development being compatible with its context and this particular site as has been noted is within the mixed use area a which is also known as the core town area a and that does speak to development in that area being primarily small-scale infill #NAME? existing policies right now great thank you yet you actually answered my second question as well thank you sorry counselor any other questions okay seeing none members to speak counselor Troi's please I first of all I do want to thank the constituents for staying and the applicant for staying all day especially on a sunny day so thanks very much I've never stood so firm on my position on a development as I have with this I've met with many resident groups not just one or two but many within a very small neighborhood so their voices were very clear in terms of the issues that they raised I'm moving an alternate motion to direct the city solicitor to attend the ALP at hearing and to retain external professional consultants as necessary to oppose the revised proposal I've reviewed reviewed the comments presented in the report and consulted with planning and legal staff while I understand the reasons for planning's conclusions I do not believe the results of the staff report gets us to the intent of the King Parliament secondary plan and the Official Plan Corktown is a neighborhood of small fine grain streets and buildings sensitive and appropriate infill development has been approved in the area several times in recent years this application does not meet that level of sensitivity many more development sites in the vicinity if approved like this could compromise the distinct low-rise character of the interior of cork town as well the West Don lands precinct just to the south is continuing its revitalization that plan calls for lower heights than this proposal and we will be we will risk disrupting the years of careful planning by the community stakeholders planning staff and Waterfront Toronto as we have heard today there is a huge amount of community opposition to this application the cork town residents and business association and residents in the immediate vicinity of the proposal are very passionate about the special character of their neighbourhood however residents are not only bringing forward concerns and feelings of anxiety the deputations today presented substantial planning arguments based on professional opinion and local expertise I believe it's important to support community concerns and they also have to be carefully considered with the reality that the planning decision making process this application falls under the regulations of the old Ontario Municipal Board and any decision has to be weighed against that framework from my discussions there is a sound case to be made to continue to oppose the application and as always there is opportunity and difference to reach an appropriate settlement before the hearing I asked members of Community Council to support my motion thank you are there any members with questions of the mover or just once for Fletcher yeah just when you've indicated that they'll can negotiations will continue up to City Council correct and there could be on what basis would there be an agreement at City Council that you would accept I think I would still have to have community consultation with that counselor so you will fully engage this fantastic Court absolutely in any discussions with for any settlement that might be proposed prior to counts absolutely thank you thank you very much any other councillors with questions for the mover no okay any other speakers no all those in favor there's only one motion before us sure yep there's a request for a recorded vote than indicate your support for the motion all those in favor councillor Davis count sir my Havok councillor Fletcher councillor wong-tam councillor tragedies councillor Layton councillor perks counter Troisi councillor McMahon councillor by Lao let the record reflect that the vote was unanimous the item as amended I believe yeah item as amended all those in favor any pose that carries thank you te 30 2.0 actually before we do that we have just got to quickly add can I please have a motion to add thirty two point ninety four to thirty two point ninety eight onto the agenda we're making it bigger not smaller now all those in favor any pose that carries thank you madam speaker madam chair I know there are some people in the audience that have been waiting all day and there are no deputies I wonder if we could clear the deck so that some people could go for the items where there are no speakers no deputations counselor unfortunately and I and I will say unfortunately there are 19 I think concert bylaw has right what they're there are about six items further down that actually have deputies and as we call these items there may be deputies I don't know so I think we need to probably best just go through it I I can't take any releases and I'm sorry I actually have a I have a family engagement at seven o'clock and unfortunately I'm not even gonna be able to it to my own family engagement so we have we have a duty to carry out and and here we are to do it te thirty two point two one 309 Cherry Street phase one and phase two zoning amendment application request for directions report any members here at public that's not a scornful look just so you know I welcome you come on come on come on up I wasn't disappointed in case you were thank you thank you chairman and you please just state your name madam chair excuse me my name is Paul Johnston I'm a land-use planning consultant I'm here on behalf of Lafarge Canada Lafarge is a cement operator that operates a cement terminal immediately south of the subject lands of 309 Cherry Street I'm here to speak briefly to you to express our support for the planning staff report and to indicate our significant concern with the proposal at 309 Cherry Street there are a number a great number of concerns set out in the planning staff report which we support these include the prematurity of that of the application the fact that flood works our flood protection is required and other measures needed including precinct planning and obviously the fact that the proposal itself does not in any way meet the planning that's been done by Waterfront Toronto or the city for this site I'll simply say however though that there are a number of that our significant concern is that the applicant has failed to address issues of compatibility with the existing industrial use the lefur juice and other uses in the area that the studies that were submitted in support of the application in fact themselves call for appropriate industrial compatibility studies which have not been completed and therefore it's not possible to know whether the application is suitable from this perspective and so that is the Lafarge issue I will conclude by simply saying that the matter that's not been addressed in the staff report is one of transportation impact the city and its studies of the area its extensive studies of the area has indicated its intent to do a traffic management plan for this area so as to allow industrial uses such as ours such as the salt operator to continue to be able to access this area for industrial purposes there are safety issues that need to be addressed we look forward to that study being completed and certainly that would be a necessary precursor to any and all development in this area so I conclude by urging you to accept your planning staff report and to oppose this application okay thank you very much mr. Johnson any questions for the speaker okay seeing none I don't believe there's any other members here because the public could speak so we would like to open this up questions of staff no questions is consulars to speak councillor Fleck yes I'd like to move the staff recommendation to refuse and note that it's a gigantic building way outside of the precinct planning that was developed for um Villiers Island and I'd like to have a recorded vote on that please okay there's a request for a recorded vote all those in favor please indicate you ask the councilors to sit in their seats Thank You councillor frog Decca Dacus we're having a recorded I'll start on this side give you time again to your chair councillor Davis indicate your support please councillor Fletcher councillor Wong tam councillor fridge' docas councillor laden councillor perks counselor Troi's e Alastair McMahon councillor by Lao let the record reflect that the vote is unanimous thank you very much we are on item T 32.2 to 286 294 Main Street zoning amendment application request for directions report members of the public anyone here to speak to this matter seeing none will bring this inside questions of staff okay councillor Davis so this this this went to the board when it was appealed it hasn't been to the board it was appealed by the applicant when maybe that were you it's not relevant it just felt to me like they went instantly it was pretty quick like the day they were eligible a three-year matter I don't believe the day they were eligible but it was appealed after the timeframe attributed in the Planning Act and prior to the preliminary meeting public meeting correct yes yes that's correct so in fact before they even met the community they'd already gone to the board so our work had appealed to the board I just want to be really clear what the things are that you are currently it's very clear that you do not support this application in its current form and I take from the report that you're concerned that it is too tall and I wondered if you could talk about the shadow impacts on the north side of the dam 4th through you madam chair is the report does be to concerns that planning staff have with the forum proposed that is reviewed in this staff report issues of height density shadowing can transition to the adjacent neighborhoods the proposal as mentioned in the report the proposal does maintain some shadow impact on neighborhood lands on the north side of Danforth Avenue approximately between 9 18 and 11 18 on the spring and fall equinoxes that does speak to some of the concern related to height on mass though there are significant concerns related to the proposal which we did which we do address in detail in the staff report okay I just wanted to ask about shadow which is it's going to hint the block north of the dam fourth the residential neighborhood north of the Danforth correct yes on the Danforth okay secondly the the proposal has no three story oh sorry three-bedroom Apartments is that correct that is correct and what would we expect that they should have based on councils adopted growing up to your guidelines we do work with applicants to attempt to achieve multiple two and three-bedroom units of a size that can support a family size units 0% is certainly not something that we would be supportive of and looking to looking for the proposal to be revised to address the recommendations of the growing up to your guidelines in full and that involves a clustering of the three-bedroom units on the first and second floors and about provisions in the design to accommodate families of strollers and play spaces and things like that certainly the guidelines do speak to the position of providing family sized units on the lower floors closer to am editing and closer to the street streetscape so you know 0% units as proposed again does create issue that staff have noted in the Indy report right and the public realm there's inadequate setbacks and improvements or proposed improvements to the public realm yes through you madam chair the proposal provides for setbacks at grade between three point three and five point nine meters the tall building design my lines of the city maintains for reviewing tall buildings does typically look to achieve setbacks at grade of about six meters to provide for appropriate sidewalk widths to ensure accessibility to ensure good walkability street trees city various city infrastructure so there's a standard substandard sidewalk condition proposed in certain areas of this application that again cause concern for staff which is again detailed in the staff this is going to the board in June before the next council meeting and you are expecting to continue discussions with them until Council is that right yes there's a there is a pre hearing scheduled on June 12th 2018 hence the report asking for direction to proceed to that pre hearing on this basis and the issues identified to discuss the issues identified in the staff report okay thank you very much any other members with questions just to clarify apologize there is no hearing scheduled at this time again just a pre-hearing in mid-june members to speak thank you very much staff recommendations and thank staff for working together we you know we we were surprised with this kind of height for this area I mean we know main and Danforth and I share with council Davis is a mobility hobbits you know fantastic that way but we were nevertheless surprised that this kind of height we've made that quite clear to the developers and trying to get them to work with us they've also heard from the community as well and so I'm I think this is smart to have this before us so if you'd like to support it that'd be great thank you very much councillor all those in favor of the recommendation for us any opposed oh sorry I apologize we did not conclude that vote councillor Davis to speak go ahead please it is an inappropriate development towards Versailles massing and lack of affordable housing lack of three-bedroom units and it absolutely needs to come in differently and has a huge impact and will set precedents for the rest of that neighborhood so I hope that the developer will recognize that and make adjustments accordingly thank you very much for your remarks any others who would like to speak okay seeing none then we still have the recommendations of the staff report before us all those in favor any opposed that carries thank you t3 2.24 request for a fence exemption to the trombonist volkova to Code Chapter four forms no what I like to do sorry I what I'd like to do is the every item that has a speaker I want to move through those speakers very quickly and they're going to come right back and I believe we can probably conclude the agenda so I'm just moving to te 32.2 for request for a fence exemption to the Toronto Municipal Code Chapter four four seven yes councillor fragile Adkins sorry madam chair the deputies have left the actual applicant had a medical appointment at three o'clock this afternoon and spoke to me and to staff and what I'd like to do with this to defer the item because they're not here and they were unable to stay okay let me just let me just read the address for the public record it's 51 Don Valley Drive the deputy tent that was here is Joanna's stable I believe she's gone as per councilor fracas if there's no other members of the public here to speak then there's a motion before us to differ all those in favor any opposed that carries thank you it says June 6 okay te 32.2 5 application to remove a city tree 209 Rosedale I'm just sorry counselor I see you wanting my attention I just want to there's a few items that have one speaker registered I what I'd like to do is just make sure we can hear from members of the public and then we'll conclude the agenda we're almost there t25 application remove at city tree tool nine Rosedale Heights Drive one speaker Steven Smith welcome good evening my name is Steven Smith and I'm a certified arborist I work for my client Jillian Johnson and Martin Shaw and they live at 209 Rosedale Heights Drive they purchased the house last August and they want to do renovations to their front garden the house is in great shape but they want to do a lot more with the front garden than what is currently there the main feature of that front garden is one city-owned European linden tree that is very very close to the front sidewalk it's also very close to the city hydro wires that run along the edge of the street consequently hydro over the years has chopped all of the branches off one side of that tree every year during its life it actually had more branches on it when I first inspected it last fall and since then hydro has been through again and taken off all of the branches that had grown out on this this street side of the street the tree the owner wishes to remove this and replace it with as many trees as we can fit on the property trees that could be further away from the street and from the wires so that they could have a chance to grow to a decent sized tree they have an opportunity to make a slightly larger front yard than they have by doing this also and the city the property is a ravine property with a forest behind it which is in bad condition I've assessed it and it full of invasive species weeds and vines completely neglected for many many years so there's an also an opportunity to have a net benefit to the city from planting at the front and also doing work in the back this work would be substantial and expensive and would be undertaken entirely at the cost of the owner they would remove the tree plant new trees and do the work in the back if this is deemed possible so I'm asking for a variation I understand that the city wants to maintain as many healthy trees as possible do you have the pictures that I sent along you do you should have a file there that shows a picture of the trees okay yes if you can look at your pictures you'll see that the tree in question is very very narrow it is being is growing to the side because of a very large tree on the adjacent lot to the west and hydro has taken off all the branches on the north side of the tree the natural form of a European linden tree if you can imagine an egg standing up on end with very wide base and quite wide all the way up this tree has been pruned into a spire essentially only about three meters across total there is very little canopy being created by that tree because of the surrounding trees and the heavy pruning that's gone on and there is enough room on the lot to plant trees that would essentially fill the whole lot with tree cover so we're asking that we be allowed to take this tree down and replaced in whatever creative way we can work out to the satisfaction of the city forestry thank you great thank you very much are there members with questions of the speaker okay seeing none members with questions the staff seeing none members to speak then oh sorry go ahead counselor no go ahead oh no no that that is fun I was simply going to move the recommendations in the staff report I was just gonna add something very quickly that we don't cut down a an enormous tree like this because we don't like the shape of it any other speakers okay well there's a motion before us is the Breck staff recommendations all those in favor any opposed that carries thank you and thank you Steven for your time te thirty-two point two six front yard parking appeal nineteen lemay Road it this matter is in war twenty-two what I'd love it are there any members of the public here to speak to it you are okay welcome just so you know I just want a state councillor Matt Lowe suggested that we defer these that I said I would defer this for him sign he dies so he'll bring it back when he feels the time is appropriate so are you okay with that okay great so then there are no speakers anyone who with questions of staff no okay then I would like to move this I would like to defer this matter T twenty point 26 to furthest matter indefinitely I was advised that you had a motion oh did he have a different instruction let me know what it is cuz I okay then all those in favor of the deferral motion any opposed that carries thank you te 32 oh sorry opposed yeah there you go okay it still carries te 30 2.27 front yard parking appeals 34 LR Beck any members of the public here to speak seeing none okay oh sorry I have a motion on that okay I'm gonna be deferring it because the polling doesn't end or he'll move the deferral motion all right yes thank you if staff could put up the deferral motion it's actually being deferred to the July meeting I've been advised by city staff that the polling won't be concluded until the 8th of May and the report won't be ready for the June meeting and in fact will be ready for the July meeting okay we've had two repol this because of some irregularities motions right there all those in favor of the deferral motion any opposed any pose council perks would you want to pose okay it still carries the record t thirty two point two eight front yard parking appeal 161 Lynne's more registered speakers Stephen Clark welcome Steven I'll begin with a note of appreciation for Nina Pellegrini who has been a valuable resource in constructing our application and appeal and I hope he's enjoying his retirement I would also like to thank counselor Freddy Dacus and her valuable staff who have helped navigate the appeal process which took a complicated turn last July with the amendment to chapter 918 finally I'd like to thank councilor by Lao who revised the conditions of that amendment so the act of Appeals like ours could be seen through to their conclusion before you today is item T 32:28 a front yard parking appeal for our home at 161 Lin's more Crescent in East York we are proposing to expand on the shared driveway we have with our neighbor to the north we are have invested in a property survey and enlisted a professional and established landscaping company that specializes in Toronto parking pads to ensure that we meet all possible requirements put forth by chapter 9 18 - 8 which governs governs front yard parking licenses as you can see from our landscaping plan we meet or exceed all open space parking area and less soft landscaping requirements on light on-site parking is not currently feasible our neighbor has requested that we keep our shared driveway clear as the resident has limited mobility and needs access to her rear entrance for herself and her support staff who visit regularly for the day there is only one requirement in conflict with our application it was determined that our application was not eligible as quote permit parking is permitted on the same side of the street on an alternating basis our application better serves the spirit of this requirement than a literal interpretation does the curb of our front house currently has room for one car the available on street parking space between our existing shared driveway and the driveway to the south is almost exactly 26 feet as a reference Volkswagen Jetta or a Honda Civic two cars that commonly Park on our street are each more than 14 feet long there's simply not enough room to legally park to such cars on that twenty five or six foot curb in fact if you look at the report for action file submitted by a city and turn to attachment fee you'll see a photo of our home that cars typically parked several feet forward from the existing curb cut now some cancel councilors here may be concerned that the city may put in a curb cut later but I can assure you that even if the city decides to put one in without us know parking spot can never be lost there is room there for only one car a truck now but there will always be room for one or car or truck we currently subscribe to a non street parking permit with subscriptions near capacity it's often difficult to secure a spot near our home we have two young children one just in just an infant anyone here who's had to unload a car with kids I hope can empathize with the struggle of carrying bags and carriers down the block across the street while keeping an eye open for cars often rushing down our one-way road if the alternate recommendations are approved we will release this on street parking permit so no spots can be lost with our application and in fact one will be freed up when presented with this information even our agnostic neighbors got behind her application we have gone out of our way to engage our neighbors and in open lines of dialogue to address any concerns the result of this can be seen in the positive poll conducted by the city I've communicated with some counselors here who regularly vote against such appeals at 2:00 again open the lines of dialogue to concern their understand their concerns that might extend beyond the reaches of chapter 9 18 dash 8 along along the side this landscaping project we have plans to remove existing shared asphalt covering much of the backyards in the this in combination with adding a second rain barrel at the front of our house means that the alternate recommendations before you today produces a positive result in diverting stormwater runoff in the city in conclusion our application for front yard parking pad meets all requirements of chapter 9 18 - 8 except where park there is parking on our side of the street on an alternating base basis we believe the spirit of this item is to prevent a private parking spot from taking over a publicly accessible parking and with this we agree however since there is no chance of a loss of a parking space and we would be releasing our on-street permit the alternate recommendations before you today better serves the spirit of this requirement than the black and white interpretation I encourage you all to vote for the alternate recommendation and allow us to improve the parking conditions for ourselves and our neighbors thank you thank you very much for your remarks I don't believe their question or no question there's there's a question go ahead please there's more permit parking near area beyond your block it sits above 90% in our area yes right but there is more permit parking beyond your block okay thank you I think we should have more permit parking available in eastern so we get pretty tight in our neighborhood but I'd be interested in seeing the results of that Oh thank you thank you very much counselor any others with questions seeing none members to speak so I just wanted to know did you know there's a survey underway about permit parking and increasing permit parking throughout the trial in East York area are you aware of that I know there's been dialogue about the parking in our area but I don't know the details of that one and there was a consultation at the Civic Center just about all the streets that don't have permanent parking and how they can get permit parking you don't sound like you know about that I don't know the details about that yeah so anyway it's worth looking into okay thank you very much councillor anyone else with questions or we move straight to speakers starting with councillor fracas go ahead and then council person clerk's have my emotion it's that I'm moving the alternate recommendations to approve the front yard parking pad at 161 Lismore pleasant okay thank you very much for your motion and it counts for perks all of this staff recommendation tonight okay yes counselor I think it might be really interesting to to put our staff to the task of identifying driveways that are no longer used in removing their curb cuts if they're not used we can be adding parking into and in into the system if they're if two parking cars can't park there but we have an unused curb cut what what's the curb cut doing there 250 thousand dollar curb cut okay so let's let's let's set up a working group to explore that at another meeting but for now let's vote on the two motions that we have before us starting with councillor fragile Jacques's motion all those in favor to approve the front yard parking please raise your hand please one count Mary's motion councillor okay one two three to approve and those opposed one two three four five councillor Fletcher #NAME? the motion to approve the staff recommendations all those in favor to deny that's correct one two three four five six and then to approve three that carries okay so the parking that's correct yes right that's right so that the application has been denied sir thank you te 30 2.29 front near parking appeal 102 Belfair Avenue packed flute Pat come on up okay let's turn our attention to the speaker before us you have five minutes when you're ready please proceed hello thank you very much good evening my name is Pat Floyd I live at 90 Belfair Avenue and I represent many Belfair residents who are a pro opposed to front yard parking at 102 Belfair Avenue because it will eliminate a parking permit space there is parking only on the west side of the street 102 is on the west side of the street and potentially it could damage the very large white birch tree that's on the front lawn this was the second time that such an application was denied a little while ago we received notice for approval for front front yard parking it was denied and we were notified of that and also in that notification it was stated that it could not be reviewed for for quite a length of time I don't exactly recall the length so we were quite surprised to get very short notice of the appeal this afternoon which is now this evening the notice hopefully was seen by lots of people I have many signatures here in the short time I only got my notice yesterday morning it was delivered to my neighbor's on Monday he returned it to me on Tuesday and so in a very short time I got about 20 signatures of people that are opposed to residents of Belfair of Nu opposed to that front yard parking at 102 okay thank you very much thank you for your remarks question of the speaker seeing none members with questions of staff seeing none members to speak councillor McMahon thank you very much and thank you to Pat for coming down I didn't see you away back there in the corner but thanks for staying all day I'm so I'm moving to my moving staff recommendations to deny this parking pad councillor perks and comes from lately you don't want to know deny the parking part there is a tree issue so I am denying it and I can and do didn't I I'm time to time thank you thank you very much anyone would like to move the alternative recommendations seeing them okay report before us staff recommendations all those opposed no okay that carries thank you t30 2.30 front yard parking appeals 77 Ludi Avenue we have a speaker Leslie grant welcome hi we saved you thank you Matt please I do have a submission I made 12 copies of a very informal not sure what to do well if you the clerk's will take that from you and he will distribute it to us thank you thank you so the parking pad application that was previously denied was from the previous owners of the house that I bought in June and the reason for the denial was a not a favorable polling result from the neighbors so the letter that you have in front of you is actually written by my neighbor immediately to the north of me who explained the situation why the neighbors objected to the parking pad in the first place so first of all I live on the east side where there is no street parking anyway so the parking pad would not be taking up a spot on the on the street in fact it would be taking my car off the street I bought the house in June my husband had died earlier in the year and so I needed to downsize I've got four kids in their 20s all very supportive of the move I didn't think I get emotional I'm sorry I knew the parking application was in process but I didn't think it would be an issue because everybody else has parking pads and it's that there's no parking on that side anyway I subsequently learned that the previous owners all of the neighbors knew that they were renovating and flipping the house and that they had no intention of living there however they did go door-to-door the owner and his pregnant sister-in-law saying they needed a parking pad they were going to live in in the house and they needed it the owners were offended are not the owners the neighbors were offended at this misrepresentation and the pole was was unfavorable so since then I've gotten to know some of the neighbors they're extremely supportive I got the notice here on Friday went door-to-door over the weekend and didn't receive any objection everybody signed the petition immediately and and and I have all their support I was called to Winnipeg on Sunday night because my father is ill so I just got back last night so that I could be here today to support the the case and I think the letter from my neighbor kind of speaks speaks to it I don't want to go over time but I'll just read one section it said the application that was made in 2016 was submitted by mr. Cade moon a developer who owned the property at that time mr. moon risk misrepresented his intentions with respect to the property to the neighbors and ultimately dispatched his pregnant sister-in-law to solicit support anyway all this to say that the neighbors were offended and and not happy about it so they have changed their tune I want to make the following points the subsequent change in ownership has significantly altered the view of the neighbors as evidenced by the attached letter I wish to be a longtime resident and hope to have grandchildren at some point which means sort of dropping them off on the front porch and then parking my car and coming back isn't really an option currently there are 27 spaces on my block and 47 permits so the chances of getting a parking spot on the on the street is very slim I have been able to secure parking a few blocks away on many occasions but I would like to say that the that the polling was the only reason the parking pad wasn't approved everything else meets the requirements I am happy to underwrite the cost of a formal pool I was told that the city wouldn't do it but I'm happy to do that if it would bring a different response certainly the response I've had from the neighbors I've been able to reach has been unanimous not a single objection everybody just oval a design for sure I'm prepared to follow the alternative recommendations to cover the cost of the ramp anything that's that's required I'd like to do an apology I didn't think it's been a long day I can't imagine how you all feel that's it any questions thank you very much for your remarks there are questions from councillor Davis oh of staff sorry I don't believe there's any questions of you so you're off the hot seat okay questions of staff counselor Davis has this of the applicant it says there is an on street parking permit registered to this address that's oh so you do have a parking yes I do have a parking permit yes I just can't find parking anywhere near the house okay as I mentioned there are 27 spaces and 43 permits okay I was worried it was wait-listed and you didn't have a permit oh no no I do I do okay yeah thank you and feel free to ask me anything if it's okay is it a question of staff or a question of stuff okay you're still off the hot seat question of staff counselor Layton thank you very much I am I to believe that if the poll came back positive this wouldn't even be before us it would be the chair that's correct okay thank you okay thank you very much any other members would question stuff you want to ask another question go ahead why would this have come back you positive when there was an alternative parking available no because permanent parking is on the opposite side of the street so permanent Park it wasn't deemed to be disqualified because of that so it's it's an application that met all the requirements of the code short of the positive pole but there was permit parking available that is correct but that's not one of the reasons for denying it in Ward 3 to YC right that is a reason for denying it in Ward 31 through the chair that is correct or 14 or 19 or 28 or okay no it's let's keep this keep the discussion to a to a minimal to zero and let's keep questions of staff if there are no more questions of staff then I'll take speakers no more questions of staff speakers councillor McMahon well I will just say that that was not a requirement that I put in so that was from previous okay so I am moving the alternative recommendations this is a very rare this is the first time this has happened oh okay so oh my gosh so I love your support thank you because it meets the requirements okay motion before us saying councillor perks go ahead oh I'm gonna move the staff recommendation sorry I thought you were voting for it so I'd like to just finish [Laughter] like I'm like who you're voting for all right so just to finish two seconds if you don't mind this met all the requirements it would not be here except the poll so I'm not sure why we wouldn't support that we wouldn't even see this application at all and unfortunately there's some discrepancy with originally with the neighbors and I think it stemmed from the previous owner of the house not the current owner so it wouldn't be here and if she goes to reapply you won't see it again because she'll get support so and I know that Street and I know they're supportive so that was the previous owner thank you for your support in advance thank you very much councillor McMahon and councillor perks is move the motion to deny any other speakers ready to vote all those in favor to approve please indicate your support no your motion first right so that would be one two three four five and then four to deny to so that carries and the other motion is redundant so te 32.3 one refusal of a boulevard cafe permit application located at 582 College Street Jameson Kurt he's he hasn't been here for hours okay great so counselor late motion and it's to approve with a very limited condition of closed doors and windows is the old College Street Bar all those in favor of the motion before us any opposed item as amended any opposed that carries thank you Adams ether I'm sorry go ahead if if we're done with the speakers that I do have somebody here that I'm not sure if they want to speak or not on 32 47 47 or 37 47 we also have speakers on 37 47 is oh okay so I'm you know what why don't we just jump around two times and one is to just clear the deck of members of the public who been waiting very patiently to speak I'm gonna jump ahead to item number te 3 2 we need 7 for quorum don't you leave Joe was at the same place I have to I think we have lost quorum the clerk is going to call for councilors who may be in the building while that happens while that happens and I'm just going to I'd like to call and hopefully we'll have harms early by just to prepare we're gonna jump ahead to item thirty two point three seven impose operating conditions to a boulevard Cafe permit located at four for force but Dyna Avenue Mervin Blaha Andrew Blaha what we need to have corn do we have okay Marvin Blaha Andrew Blaha are you here and my friend hello sorry I just long long time friend who is here no one's here okay if that's the case why don't we just deal with it because it's are they Conor there are speakers here but not here okay so I've just called for item 37 let's just deal with it because it's now before us how would you like to proceed counselor Krusty's item counselor Lane yes thank you I have instructions from counselor cressie that he'd like to move the staff rack how this is written is it move amendment that we need councillor Davis back in the room counselor can you please take a seat in your chair this is move amendment that recommends there's an operating condition on the okay I'm reading his sheet wrong so okay motion is before us all those in favor of the motion I would still it's a delete the following from the recommendation and add the following that's what I have yeah that what you got up there okay okay all those in favor any opposed item as amended any pose that carries thank you we're just gonna jump back to te thirty two point three six I've been notified there are speakers the item title is the refusal of a boulevard Cafe permit application located 267 College Street we have speakers right good evening I guess I was too excited when I screamed up my friend I haven't seen this guy in a long time sorry but I would not be prejudiced I promise okay go ahead good evening would like to discuss the refusal of our patio license for our Pizza Nova located at 267 College Street we have been informed - no I won't take up much time but I wanted to note that we've been a member of that community and in business there for well over 20 years and have had the patio for that entire time our franchise owner Martin Taurani is here with me today who is this we'd like to just sort of strongly and respectfully request that you approve this patio for us I'm not sure what the denial all of a sudden is about but I'm hoping we can strain it out we have although our legal address says to 6/7 College our access point is actually about 40 metres oh sorry forty feet south of College on Spadina so we're not actually on College Street are in and out is on Spadina Avenue just south of College and we depend heavenly heavenly on U of T business and so our sales per week will drop about thirty five percent once school's out so that patio does help us mitigate sort of the summer months of U of T loss of sales so it's very important to us to help you have that patio we've actually just purchased new furniture and umbrellas to enhance the look of our patio to attract more business and I mean apart from that Martin I think those are those are real reasons that we we would like to get our pad approved moving forward thank you very much are there any members with questions of this speaker okay councillor Davis so it was refused because it wasn't it was blocking the sidewalk they didn't meet the two point one I believe two point one three meter so why can't you adjust it so that it will be too small yeah it was it would it would drastically reduce the size of the patio to a point where you basically have a tiny table in two chairs and it just I we've had that patio for over 20 years the entire time that we've been in business at that corner I believe we're at one point four five just under 1.5 meters I think it says point nine five but I'll ask staff okay any other members with questions of the speaker seeing none okay thank you very much members with questions the staffs are councillor Davis go ahead okay so I am a member of do you have questions there's ability committee and I you know what you have fuller why is it refused does it have to do with the separation is it the separation is through you madam chair it's the it's the pedestrian clearance requirement of two point one three right so the AODA requires one point five what is this this is 0.95 and how long have we had point one point five as the requirement we we've had two point one one we for a long time in in the cafe bylaw so that's what we go by but the excitability is is one point five and you have asked them over many years to bring it into compliance you're saying we asked any applicant who doesn't meet the 2.13 to bring it under compliance but they can appeal our refusal and that's why we're here today and when what did they first receive notice of the file here I'm trying to go by memory it's right you don't know I'm trying to bring on D looks like there were two or three notices given the reason I'm asking is there's been inconsistent enforcement all the time it seems were they given notice many years ago I'm not sure about that counseling okay sorry Ben okay maybe that doesn't get to respond when we're asking questions of staff sorry okay January 26 March 13 any other members with questions of staff seeing none members to speak house her Layton unfortunately counselor Chrissy asked me to take care to this item as well and his instructions were to the move the staff recommendations to deny yep okay all those anybody else to speak to deny okay so I'm just I'll speak very quickly I am mindful of time the excessive the trial excessively Advisory Committee is very clear about their recommendations moving forward especially in a growing city crowded sidewalks in order to have safe passage of two people going in by direction on a sidewalk the pedestrian clearway moving forward they have requested has two point one meters at the very minimum although not official as of yet but it really does speak to exactly the same rules that are already in place by the by the flankers patio and guidelines so I just want to clarify that so we all know that's that's the direction the city is heading in so motion before us to adopt the staff recommendations all those in favor any opposed okay that carries thank you you can serve a patio is just got me no more narrow okay thank you so we are now I believe 47 had an eye has speaker and and I think they're they're okay not to speak in letter okay already spent the whole day with us but they're not and I have a motion on this item we just want to be here to make sure that it clears okay but they don't work but they're not speaking okay so let me just read it into the record so it's te thirty two point four seven fifty seven to seventy seven wait Avenue the zoning amendment application preliminary report and I'd like to have the expanded notice and just make a note that this is seven story employment building timber in my area that we're very very excited to welcome jobs in our community so we hope that this will be the first of many of this these projects because we like building residential but we love also people to work in our communities and being able to build employment spaces so we're excited to going to the community with this community meeting and and have the project going going through so just wanted to make note of that and if I could ask for your support for the expanded notice and that the preliminary report thank you very much councillor by Lao all those in favor any opposed item as amended and he opposed that carries thank you so I believe there are no more member are there no more public differences are there any members here in that are here to speak to any particular matter because if when you're because we're gonna go through things very very good can I get it updated 32 okay no the only reason I held it was because the caster wasn't here okay so we are now going to begin we're gonna go back to the 10 a.m. items and we're gonna blow through this very quickly this is as efficient as it's going to be te 32.5 that's our bylaw yes twelve twelve volt counselor by loud 12:09 12 32 1234 Jensen Island 12:40 CJ 1250 and 1264 College Street zoning amendment final report number 5 how would you like to proceed odd to approve recommendations okay thank you all those in favor any opposed that carries thank you te 32.3 one reef which I think we just go with we did three one worth three two we did three one yes sorry and so three two did we do three - okay I'm relying on you here thirty thirty two point three two refusal of a boulevard cafe permit application located six six nine College Street Ward 19 I have a motion to approve with a condition around windows and doors and live music all those in favor any opposed that carries thank you te thirty two point three three refusal Boulevard Cafe permit application located 696 College Street Roxton Road flank Accord nineteen I have a motion to approve with the following conditions okay are on time and noise and all the stuff that we normally put in okay all those in favor okay any opposed I carry and I think item as amended all those in favor and opposed that carries thank you te thirty two point three five impose operating conditions to Boulevard Cafe permit located at three Baldwin Street or twenty I think we missed 34 there this is the Arab Society college as well I apologize t 32.3 for refusal of a boulevard cafe permit application located 890 College Street Delaware Avenue flanca CH I have some operating conditions in a motion to approve the patio motion on the screen please okay all those in favor any opposed item as amended any posts that carries thank you now we're at three five impose operating conditions to a boulevard cafe permit located three Baldwin Street councillor Layton yes the instructions from the councillor was to move the staff recommendations and they had some conditions to approve okay so removing a conditions first are there conditions conditions in a staff report it's already inside the Safran yeah okay so we're just moving the recommendation staff Rex all those in favor any opposed that carries thank you te thirty two point three three eight refusal Boulevard Cafe permit application with Dec local okay de for fifteen Spadina Road Lonsdale Road blanket or 22 I believe councillor mallow would like to see this application approved so just put that on the screen yes and this is a second cup folks so any all those in favor any posts carry thank you we now move to T thirty two point five eight Dufferin Street from Dundas Street West to Bloor Street West extended peak parking period regulations Ward eighteen councillor by Lao we are just deferring that to June the deferral request to June okay not a problem what we are an item number 58 in my apologies clerk okay 58 please all those in favor of the deferral any opposed that carry ve 32.6 for traffic control signals College Street at half block street rush home park Crescent and College Street at Gladstone Avenue counselor by Lau move staff recommendations all those in favor any opposed carry t 32.6 8 traffic calming speed hums McAuley Avenue counselor by Lau move alternate recommendations there you go all those in favor any opposed that carries t thirty two point six nine traffic calming speed hums brusett Avenue councillor by Lao this is 69 is this a this is motions to approve do we need to show anything on the screen okay great all those in favor any opposed that carries adopted sorry te thirty two point seven one traffic calming speed hums Hanson Street councillor McMahon I already did that this morning I had a little nice speech about that remember sorry yeah you you can you can you kindly move it again okay sure I won't do the speech again but move alternate recommendations and hopefully we'll get the warrant switch hey all those in favor any opposed that carries thank you t thirty two point seven seven endorsement of events for liquor licensing purposes I don't believe there anymore I have a motion on that one okay the councillor Layton story and this was just to take the week days away from north by northeast at a location that's in an residential neighborhood but they'll will permit on weekends okay all those in favor any opposed item as amended any opposed that carries T thirty two point eight zero parking amendments for Brock Avenue counselor by allow approve recommendations on the letter okay all those in favor any opposed carried T thirty two point eight one speed humps insulation on Brock Avenue Dundas Street West to Florence Street counselor by Lao groove recommendations on the letters all those in favor any opposed that carries te thirty two point eight two accessible loading zone requests in the north side of College Street between a point of seventy seven meters west have done Dufferin Street and a point of eleven meters further west councillor by Lao approved recommendations on the letter okay all those in favor any opposed carried te thirty two point eight three parking amendments for Ostler Street DuPont Street with caribou Avenue councillor by Lao approved recommendations in the letter okay all those in favor and the oppose that carries thank you t thirty two point eight for reopening of item te 31.9 sixth title parking amendments on Sheridan Avenue between Dundas Street West and College Street councillor by Lao I think we have to reopen it first move to reopen yeah and all those in favor of the recommendations before us now correct yep that carries all those in favor any opposed Kerry thank you to you thirty two point eight five parking amendment for Sudbury Street to approve recommendations on the letter all those in favor any opposed carried t30 2.86 reducing the speed limit on Dover Court Road Dundas Street West to Queen Street West Ward 1819 recommendations in the letter okay all those in favor any opposed married te thirty two point eight nine expanding permit parking on Riverdale app and you okay all those in favor and a poll was carried te thirty two point nine zero traffic safety on Riverdale Pape to kiss WIC all those in favor and he opposed carried t thirty two point nine one pain display on Eastern Avenue okay all those in favor any opposed carried T 32.9 262 Chester Hill Road file number a one three five six / 170 why 429 I will move the recommendations in the letter any opposed carried te thirty two point nine three potential heritage properties at 490 492 494 496 and 500 College Street and 307 309 and 311 Palmerston Boulevard Ward 19 move the recommendations in the letter all those in favor any opposed carried t thirty two point nine four appeal to toronto local appeal body t lab of minor variances of 16 york street ward 19 york street on what street york street not word 19 i think that's worth 2800 sorry queens keys yeah no sorry we're on item number 94 i don't have the item we'll move the recommendations in the letter that is war 20 it's actually war 20 okay recommendations in the letter all those in favor any opposed carried te 30 2.95 lane designation cleans he east at Yonge Street war 28 that would be me move approval please all those in favor and he opposed carried t thirty two point nine six J McPherson green and the relocation of the Enbridge gas distribution district station for twenty seven I would move the recommendation than the letter all those in favor any opposed carried T te thirty two point nine seven guide rail at the northwest corner the curve at O'Connor drive at Bravo Avenue or twenty nine I will move the recommendations in the letter all those in favor any opposed carried te thirty two point nine eight College Street planning study rush home road to Lansdowne Avenue Ward eighteen recommendations on the letter was in favor any opposed carried madam madam Speaker those are the only two okay so madam Speaker I give me one second we've dealt with five for about 23 item number twenty thirty two point two three intention to designate intention to DES in the under part for section 29 of the Ontario Heritage Act and authority to enter into a heritage Eastman agreement fifty King Street East war twenty-eight thank you move staff recommendations all those in favor any opposed carried I believe that brings us to nothing actually you have a request to reopen an item thirty two point six nine actually did a mistake I would like to refer that to the June council 32 six motion to reopen te thirty-two point six nine traffic calming speed hums reset Avenue motion to reopen and the firt in June motion to defer until June because we've got nothing to do in June all those in favor okay any opposed carry okay Bill's done got the general Toronto East York Community Council passing declares bylaws bills five five seven two five seven zero five seven six two five two seven eight and five eight zero two five nine five prepared for the may 2nd 2018 meeting 32 thank you very much and then counselor oh sorry um all those in favor any opposed Carrie councillor Lane at the Toronto and Easter Community Council pass and declare as a bylaw confer Tory bill to confirm the legislative proceedings in Toronto and Easter Community Council acting on a delegated authority of meeting 32 inmate second 2018 all those in favor opposed carried we want to thank everybody especially the clerk's they received make over two hundred and thirty pieces of communications which they all had to log and we all had to read which is good but thank you very much and I want to thank the members who actually stayed and I know many of you had know many of you had obligations including myself but thank you yep we're all late

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