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Verlag fur dissertationen capstone project high school for money writing a book report on dash by kirby larson [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] this is a test for the closed captions a test for the closed captions audio check for the closed captions test one two one two three four five just for the closed caption [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] excuse me everybody we are waiting because we do not have a quorum yet we have a few people that are within five minutes of being here so if you could please be patient with us [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] okay good morning everybody I'm going to call this special workshop meeting of August 25th to order and again I apologize for the delay but I really even though we're not making any decisions today I thought it was important that we give a my colleagues enough time to get here because it's we're going to cover a lot of really important information so if we could start with the roll call please okay so before we get started I want to go through a couple of housekeeping items first of all our meeting is being live-streamed and we will also have b1 o4 as an overflow room staff is going to be sharing a great deal of information with us today I think they'll be throwing a lot at us and so for efficiency on what staff has done is their presentation has been divided into various segments so even though it's one agenda item I'm going to ask that everyone hold their questions until we get to a slide that says questions and then I'm going to ask for any questions that we have or the material up to that point and we're just going to kind of keep doing this so that we can hopefully absorb oh here and then let's see at the conclusion of every full agenda item okay that's when I will be taking public comments so again I will not be taking public comments when we take the break to ask questions from the board members but instead at the conclusion of each of those items if you plan to address the board most of you are familiar with the routine please fill out one of these blue cards so that we can manage our time effectively and and colleagues and people in the audience this is planned to be about a three-hour meeting so anyway I think we're going to go ahead and get started here and we're going to start with our public comments I have one public speaker and this is for items not on the agenda rolling LeBron um good morning madam chair and directors and when I gonna be talking about his a be on 76 we seize the finally home spill as you may have read in the press if San Jose have taken a leadership position and are going as well as expected and initially I was going to stay away for this because quite frankly I don't have the bandwidth however when 1000 of my disability the maximum occupancy of 200 and decided maybe the time come to get involved in the solution I came up with for your consideration a joint venture between the city of San Jose the VTA and the Clara eventually what the county would do would be these unused VTA properties specifically I trail parking lots which typically are not near anyway this would basically improve by the temporary solution and also improve the Vijay's bottom line which slowly needs to be addressed right now truly easing revenues potentially providing services that the VTA already provides and also definitely increase ridership which is something that we need so lee-san you in closing I will be introducing this to district 2 in the santa teresa library on monday evening at 7 o'clock and i don't want to turn this into a political circus but I encourage you to have staff attending and actually listening to what the committee has to see what the reaction is thank you very much I don't have any other public speakers and so we are going on to our workshop items which is what we're here for today and so with that item three item three we're going to have our general manager and CEO Nerium give a few comments by way of introduction thank you very much now madam chair and good morning to all of you I want to welcome you to the first of two workshops that we'll be having to outline two critical elements of the largest transportation infrastructure project in Santa Clara County PTAs Bart Silicon Valley the extension project as you know is happening in two phases we're heading into the home stretch of phase 1 the 2.3 billion dollar project that extends from warm spring in South Fremont to Mel pitas and San Jose and today Dennis Radcliffe will give you an update on the progress of the phase 1 project as well as talk about the passenger Revenue Service next summer phase 2 is in its final stage of the environmental review process and we anticipate beginning mistral engineering early construction activity on this four point seven billion dollar project next year with passenger service expected in 2026 but this is what I want to emphasize to every board member the timing of the decisions that you will make on the various elements of this phase are very crucial both of the billions of dollars on the line and the thousands of people that are counting on us to deliver a great project and reliable service so this is the moment when you would not only shape VTA's Bart's Silicon Valley extension but you're also shaping the vision and opportunities for this valley as it relates to how people move how they've decided to work near where they live and when they decide to live near this big infrastructure investment so this is the reason why we felt that it was important to have this presentation in two phases through two workshops giving you the time necessary to absorb a lot of information that you'll need to make you comfortable making the decision making important decisions that would be presented to you decisions that have long-term implications and benefits for this region you can sense the urgency that it is palpable it's not just presenting information but recognizing one very specific action and that is that back in 2016 the Federal Transit Administration approved our entry into project development so that means that we have to two years which is coming up on March of 2018 to be ready to move into project engineering and that date is quickly approaching now there are no more floats available so these decisions have to be made in a timely manner it is imperative that we get our Record of Decision from the FTA in early before the March 2018 deadline so with that I would like to turn it over to back to you madam chair so that you can make your remarks and then we will get started with the presentations hey Thank You Maria okay I want to touch on phase one for a moment encouraging you all to keep sight on the fact that VTA is a partner the fact that VT is a partner in this project with Bart it's a strong partnership to make phase one to get across the finish line we have to remember that we are in a partnership we have come to a place in this process where we are increasingly reliant upon the work of a BART and what they must do in order to deliver this project in the time we've committed to our FTA partner and to our community we'll need to pay close attention to some very technical issues which I think our staff has done a very good job of distilling it down for all of us to really get a clear picture of where we are and the team is going to continue to work diligently through each of the milestones as they present that to us now in terms of Phase two this is going to be a different animal okay so be different for a number of reasons but first and foremost the line from Warm Springs to Berryessa which is part of phase one is all above-ground and largely in a pre-existing rail corridor phase two features a five mile tunnel straight through the heart of San Jose every major infrastructure construction project has impacts but it is incumbent upon us as good neighbors to mitigate those impacts on businesses and residents as best we can five miles of tunneling does not happen overnight so we have to understand this and be cognizant of it we're charged with making the important decisions on how to carry out and accomplish this project and I believe we have the very best staff there is out there to help us guide us through this they have done their diligence in studying the feasibility of the new tunneling methodology and embarked on us on study trips to see firsthand what could be realized similarly here in Silicon Valley what's left is the independent comparative analysis of the tunneling methodologies which we will study more closely at the next board workshop again this is the independent comparative analysis again as I remind you that we are in this with Bart if it moves us to work more closely with their board as we reach some of the final stages of phase 1 and move into the beginning of phase 2 because this relationship is so important I ask that you all join me on September 28th um so yeah put this on your calendars please September 28th at the Warm Springs station for a special joint meeting with the BART Board of Directors and there will be more details to the board members that will follow thank you for your commitment for being here today committing to attending the next workshop and as well as hopefully to the joint meeting with the BART Board your commitment is enormously important to the sexes now the success of this undertaking so let's get to work and let's move on to our first item on the agenda but this is to receive a status report of VTA's Bart Silicon Valley phase one which was known as a Berryessa extension and we have Dennis Radcliffe deputy director of the second valley art of the SDRT Bart capital program who will provide a brief report thank you very thank you very much in order to preserve as much time for Phase two I'll make this quite short I think many of you have seen progress photos before it's very difficult for us to keep the aerial photographs up to date there's so much progress being made this photographs from about a month ago it's like to say that the project is reaching the end of construction right now here at Milpitas station they are finalizing all the architectural finishes they're assembling the final bits of the bus station you see there in the center left and making the campus ready for final paving we expect to have all of that done by the end of this year inside the Milpitas station you can see we have the art glass installed this is west side looking out it's comparable so glass on the east side generally speaking this is one of the final items finishes inside we generally do that from the top down so that you know subsequent activities don't get in the way it's quite nice because the Sun shines through here and I like from the top skylight but also with the art glass I Berryessa station you can't see very well here but we've got the art glass blazing in at the high roof they we also have landscaping underway and just the final bits of the station construction and readying the guideway for train testing which is the subsequent stage of events oh did I miss one yeah okay so this is the milestone summary leading to passenger service in June of 2018 and as you can see on the left station construction is still underway but we're really just finishing up finishes interior and exterior at each of the stations we are now installing fare gates and other station controls all of that will be done by the end of this year leaving the remaining activities focused entirely on systems testing we do system testing in three stages as static testing dynamic testing and integration testing bring static testing we essentially test the track and the wayside facilities and making sure all communications and controls are working as intended and readying for dynamic testing which is the movement of trains dynamic testing is where the trackway and the wayside and the operations Control Center communicate with the Train and vice versa and control all of the train movements once that's done all of the extension is essentially ready for operations except for the final integration testing where Bart will be taking over the testing program and will be repeating much of the dynamic testing from the BART operations control center this is necessary to assure that the all of the operational requirements and objectives are integrated properly into the extended Bart network that will be concluded once Bart has been satisfied that all of the safety criteria are satisfied for safety certification this process has been continuing now for about ten years and in tight coordination with the California Public Utilities Commission once all of Bart and CPUC and other regulatory bodies are satisfied that everything is ready for passenger service then Bart will be able to initiate passenger service and make it available to the public so those are the main milestones leading to passenger service and we happy to answer any of your questions questions um I do not go ahead okay okay so no questions yes thank you I said something about the 28th for the meeting what time and where it's only a couple days away here right it's September 28th okay September pologize all right September 20 but do you have a time early morning 9:30 in the morning the board secretary's office is going to us they're working out some final logistics and such and we'll talk a little bit more we'll get to the announcements on that okay I do not have any public speakers on this item so that we will now move on to item three point two and Thank You Dennis and three point two is a discussion of phase twos critical activities and we have Carolyn go not director of engineering and transportation Aubrey who is going to produce and present this item morning okay so as madam chair and the general manager mentioned was that is these decisions that we're going to have to make regarding Phase two of the extension and with a four point seven billion dollar extension the later we go the higher the costs go up so it's these key decisions are really important for us to keep on track and the ability to move forward in both the funding process that we've entered with the federal government but also in terms of our obligations to getting something delivered for the voters in this County have given us overwhelming majorities each time to putting this extension to downtown San Jose into Santa Clara so today is we have three activities where we're coming to the board over the next month and a half or six weeks the first is today which we're just going to give you a quick history of the Phase two project what the environmental clearance update is since we have the draft on the street we're about to go with the final being released on the street in the next eight weeks or so the environmental evaluation criteria primarily that criteria that we're going to use it to make decisions about the different options that are in the document and the steps to the tunnel methodology design on September 22nd we were actually be coming forward with the results of that final tunneling options comparative analysis and risk assessment as well as our you know any activities in terms of what we think the environmental draft project description is what that means is that's the definition of the project that the federal government will give us a record of decision on as well as this board would vote on the what the project adoption is for the final project description so we will actually be coming forward with a draft staff recommendation for discussion by the board on October 5th we will be taking those recommendations to the board for action on both the final project description and the approval of the final project description to go into the Final EIS and finally IR so those are the number of activities that will be happening current over the next six weeks if there's any questions regarding that I'm just gonna go with a little bit of background on the project right now there we as you know and we've just mentioned this a number of times you see it all the time is we have the ten mile extension under construction which is phase one so originally this project was thought to be 16 miles under construction but it's a fairly large project a very large project very difficult to finance all so we actually split the project in and as chair Bruins mentioned we actually have but most of it is in the railroad corridor so it was fairly easy to move that 10 miles out and get that moving in particularly when we were moving that project and it's a time when the valley was experience a recession and we were able to actually move forward even with the sales tax monies that we have brought in with the federal full funding grant agreement we actually anticipate opening that up with a 25,000 average weekday ridership that extensions costing about 2.4 billion dollars as you see each month there's also about 300 million dollars worth of activities that we have in the railroad corridor as well in terms of advancement utility relocation we did some great separations of the interchanges with partners this is a number of activities that we did do earlier on phase 2 extension we have a six mile project which is includes a five mile tunnel with the last mile primarily a crate coming into the new hole yard and then terminating at the Santa Clara station we have four stations in that location three of them were subway or underground Alum Rock 28th Street the downtown San Jose station and the Deardon station Santa Clara station would be a grade with potentially a right now we're looking at a access that would be the mezzanine were below the area now I'll show a picture of that Santa Clara station and a little bit we also have a large new whole yard facility with 200 plus vehicles to be stored Bart right now has a for operating yards and what they are planning on doing is expanding to over a thousand vehicles and so this yard is required to not only house the ones that will purchase which will be roughly between 120 and 130 vehicles they also would be storing additional vehicles it'll be about 200 plus vehicles so that when they start service in the morning the vehicles are done at the end of our line we also anticipate the opening ridership right now it to be about 33,000 thousand average weekday ridership and as we mentioned earlier this projects quite large four point seven billion dollars that does that is actually before we go through this risk assessment with FTA and excludes the finance costs which is what so this is typically just the construction softened costs and construction costs we mentioned a little bit about the VTA Bart partnership just real quickly there is a comprehensive agreement that was signed in 2001 by both agencies and it lays out the roles and responsibilities as well as ways to go about our business in terms of working together but there are there are some activities that we're still working on and you'll see a number of agreements we once in a while bring forward and the larger one will be the OEM agreement that will come forward soon that gives a little more definition to what these responsibilities are but right now VTA pays all the costs associated with the extension capital and operating costs and any rehabilitation costs as well we are in charge and responsible for the contracting procurement for constructing the project and design engineering construction of the project we construct two applicable Barton industry standards codes and regulations and we also retain ownership for all the infrastructure this is very different for Bart right now Bart for the most part outside of maybe the airport does not own the infrastructure in our case in our County we own all the infrastructure including we will own the vehicles that are running on the system that we've have purchased so that's a little bit different than most but as part of its because we're not in the Bart district as well the Bart responsibilities as they provide technical assistance while we're designing and constructing it they do all the operations the maintenance and the fare policy they set they also set the service plan but that's in coordination with VTA just a little history on the program even though this has longer history than 2000 in 2000 really the catalyst for this was when the sales tax measure was passed in 2000 and the VTA board had moved forward on a major investment study and selected this as the as a politically preferred alternative and we were able to enter the federal New Starts project we actually were moving forward on getting an environment we already had a draft environmental document out on the street for the full 16 miles but at that time part but the Warm Springs project into the federal process and they were we were not able to get a record decision on the 16 mile project before they got one because we needed that piece of the Warm Springs extension at the times the Warm Springs was only going for a state environmental document so we went forward and got the state clearance anyways and then in 2005 we withdrew from the New Starts program and try to determine how we were going to build this project we didn't have a funding source for operation and maintenance since the sales tax had declined substantially since 2000 so we went through and that is when we actually move forward and phasing the project phase 1 and in 2007 we actually kicked off the environmental process again in 2008 we did the past the half cent or 1/8 cent sales tax for the operation maintenance so at that time we were in very good stead to move forward into the new starts process we had met our OEM obligation the project was faced where we could finance the construction and we were able to move that piece forward and the board committed to that in February 2000 in February 2009 we received the NEPA clearance for it in 2010 and we quickly moved forward and getting a full funding grant agreement in less than I think we did in about 16 months that right 18 months to a full funding grant agreement in 2012 and that that point we've been in construction on the Phase one project and Phase two miri initiated the planning efforts took a look and we'll give you a little bit of background throughout the day about exactly what we've looked at you know how tunneling technology has changed as well as some options have become available in terms of the alignment and the stations and we move forward a notice of preparation which is to start to the environmental clearance process for the six mile extension and as part of that we have been moving forward and released the draft in December 2016 and the voters actually supported the project again with including us in the sales tax measure B for half cent sales tax so currently we are in good stead to move forward to try to get the remaining funding sources for the Phase two extension just to go to completion right now it's we're in the critical stage in defining the project and I mentioned that a little bit earlier over the next six weeks we hope to have that defined we hope to have a record of decision in March like March 2018 at that point we can move into new starts engineering and then move forward on the full funding grant application and we would really like our our goal is to have that by December 2019 to have the full funding grant agreement that allows us to go into project construction we can do some project pre construction activities earlier on but at that point we're in full gear to do that and to build it over the next five to six years including system testing and be online on 22:26 the funding strategy right now is that we've expended about 160 million dollars in funding there was a lot of engineering done on the first 16 mouths in the mid-2000s on the project and so we have done about 160 million dollars worth of engineering activities we have state and local funds of which both existing measures sales a sales tax and the 2016 sales tax measure B are committed and that would be about three point two five billion we're looking at a match of federal funds of 1.5 billion and we're moving forward that process today with the FT I mean we're in that process today before the FTA new starts federal program or what you might also come here is the capital investment or grant program current projected funding is four point nine one billion that's a buffer because we know we will probably have to add some costs in there for risk project that's what FTA requires us to do before we sign a full funding grant agreement just a real quick graphic of the phase two extension project many of you seen this before late we'll go into a little bit more on the alignment options but from the various extension on the East we will go south we go into a tunnel portal under 101 into the Allen rock station near 28th Street just north of Santa Clara we then turn on to Santa Clara Street still in a subway come into the downtown there's two options there for the for the station we then go under 87 and under the creek and then over to the dirt on station there's two options right now we're looking at in that location and then we continue in subway two we go under 880 and then come out into primarily the right before the Newhall yard and we come into the Newhall yard area and and terminate at the Santa Clara station any questions on the history or project description but go back a couple of slides to the FT and you thought about that one so I was a little confused because I thought the FTA Record of Decision March 2018 had to do with phase one that has to do with Phase two yeah that's Phase two so they'll give us a record decision which is after we complete the the federal environmental process they give us a record of decision that completes that that process for us and that allows us to start with what so that gives us the ability to move forward into well we can move into engineering any ways we can do that at risk it allows us to move forward on some of the advance utility relocations it allows us to do any long lead-time items that so for example like tunnel boring machine and start moving forward on your contract procurements you're really doing a lot of work to sort of finalize the definition of the project to get ready for construction okay so you'd be ready for construction at March 2018 so in March 2018 no so that's when we would actually be getting the complete environmental process then we go in that sort of that green bar and the yellow bar new starts engineering is the federal process so that's the area we would be into we would start above which right now we would do engineering and pre-construction activities and then full construction really is at the time we receive the full funding grant agreement which we're anticipating at the end of nine 2019 that's almost a two-hour two-year process from the 2018 yeah yeah it takes it takes FTA about six to eight months to actually get you funding grant agreement so from the time we submit everything for them to start to review and look that's that it's gonna take six to eight months we're really looking at about a year till we can get the application in which we need to be very comfortable about the project that we have all those risk assessments and everything gets done at that time as well thank you for the cartridges ID so in terms of that 2020 um I mean right now that's you know clearly a major projection all but in terms of trying to get something where there's more of that expectation so right before you sign the full funding grant agreement so for example on ours we had we have and currently on the phase 1 we have June 2018 that was done through a lot of analysis based on how we thought we were gonna construct the project everything and so we ended up with a June 2018 date that's what signed into the FTA full funding grant agreement so it's really during that New Starts engineering process looking at the project how it would be constructed there's a lot of activities that happen over those next two years it's actually and all the risk assessments and agile assessments of both scheduling costs to actually define what we think the dollar number is and what the schedule will be so that's will actually be more well known and about a year and a half from now late late 2018 type of are you saying that the environment and clearance is pretty much done or you got only a couple months left on it the environmental clearance right now we plan on releasing the final in end of the by the end of the year and that gives them three months to give us the Record of Decision now I will say I don't want to say it's no there can be changes here and there smaller once we've had a number of administrative changes that happen once you're into engineering you know and you're looking at some different things but nothing we haven't we never had anything really significant that we had to go back out and release a document and the environmental appearances that we're talking about here they're not subjective to which type of boring technique that we're choosing or so it will so right now we do have it and we you will have to decide between the the tunneling methodology as part of the record and decision fj will give us now we have a full clearance so if something changes and there and there's modifications we can go back in and modify the record decision in the future so this ties back to when we saw the schedule in terms of you know we have this workshop we've got the workshop on the 22nd and then on October 5th the coming to the board and making these decisions part of if you take that march date and you start by Rimmel clearance then you back up with the environmental clearance you back up to our decision point that's how it all kind of nest together October 5th and I can't impress upon the board members enough October or us to try and keep the project on on track okay and that's why these workshops this is all about building up our knowledge and such so that we can have all the information that we require policymakers to and just to give you guys a warning before I turn it back over to Carolyn if when we're done when staffs done we're pausing to ask questions as we go when we're done with this item I am gonna go around down the line to get half knows what we the information we need so we can be so on the next phrase I'm gonna have Tom fitzwater he's our environmental manager for the program to come up and give the next presentation good morning chairperson and board members we're nearing the homestretch of an environmental document and it's been a very long long process I've been involved with it for almost 17 years and when I look around the room today I can see others that have been volved much longer than I have so this is a quite an accomplishment to get to this point in time as Carolyn mentioned there have been a number of previous environmental documents that we've developed over the years and if you usually go back to 2004 when we did the finally IR for the 16 mile project he would have had local funds we could have actually built the project and an approved environmental document and we could have built the 16 Mile 6 station at the 60 but we didn't have the money so that's why we're here today yet we've done another we've done a number of refinements to the project over the years with supplemental environmental documents and we we went to the FTA to get federal environmental clearance so we could secure federal dollars and and we're now kind of at that final environmental document that hopefully will will get us over the over the finish line so the draft environmental document is out there and it does address environmental alternatives and because this is both the state and federal document it gets a little bit confusing for the state environmental document we have three alternatives and there's the no-build alternative which is basically do nothing there's the part extension alternative which is the for station extension which we've been talking about you know since 2004 and we've also added a BART extension with transit-oriented joint development alternative and this includes commercial retail residential development at the stations in their locations and it's really designed to implement the intent of various cities general plans you know we're trying to be consistent with the intent of their general plans so that's the third alternative that we're dealing with in terms of the state environmental document we go to the federal environmental document they are not concerned about devel you know they will not federally participate in the funding effect of development around Santa Clara County so they're only concerned with the no build alternative and the BART Extension alternative and so when they do their record of decision they will be making a decision on on those two alternatives and as Carolyn mentioned the record Record of Decision will be defining the options that we've identified an environmental document so the environmental document does address a variety of options and that gives the VTA Board of Directors the option of picking different options or alternatives and it also gives FTA the the option of being consistent with the VTA board of directors selection or or coming up with something different than the Record of Decision the environmental document does have some new options and new considerations and certainly the San Jose East option is is something about being looked at and fully addressed in the environmental document we have a dear Don north option which basically moved this station closer to Santa Clara Street looked at various station entrance locations and we tried to optimize those entrance locations so in some cases we've deleted entrances and other places who tried to refine those entrances to make them more effective and we have the transitory enjoyment at a number of the construction staging areas and essentially those mean that it's transitoria joint development at the station locations a single bore construction methodology we've had some refinements and additional studies that have looked at the single bore technology and so that will be clarified in the final we've been involved with this environmental document certainly since January of 2015 when we knew the Nosa preparation we had scoping meetings in February of 2015 we had three scoping meetings number of people attended those and provide comments and identified issues which they wanted addressed in that in the draft environmental document we did release the environmental document in December of 2016 we had three public hearings about 170 people attended was well attended lots of comments lots of discussion and we actually extended the comment period until March 6 so normally the comment period would be 45 days but because several individuals and organizations requested a longer comment period we extended that comment period to accommodate their needs we had approximately 860 individual comments so there are a lot of comments to be addressed in the document it came from about a hundred and ten different agencies or individuals commenting so in some cases an individual would have ten comments you know so it's one commenter but he has ten comments and that's how we came up with the number of 860 comments we've had a number of opportunities to go out in the community and explain the project we've had community working group meetings that were established in May of 2015 those been have been meeting on a regular basis with a number of participants from the local agencies that if additional engagements or meetings you know I've attended several of those community meetings and we actually did want it darling elementary school too so we've we've tried to reach out to the community when they've requested additional meetings we also had a live webinar which a number of people participated in we've in terms of the comments we received you know the 860 is a lot of comments there were a lot of comments just supporting the project or supporting various options they have have a preference for one option over another for their individual reasons in terms of the project description there are a lot of comments about the alignments of the alignment over what right now we're going under 101 on East Side you know at one time we looked at using a U P a railroad track bridge that's over 101 and so we're going to talk about that in the environmental document lots of comments about the transitory enjoyment of element what does that mean what are you doing that going to be accomplished station locations you know as I mentioned downtown San Jose we've got downtown San Jose fest dear Adan north and south and comments about Santa Clara station why are we doing a Santa Clara station in Kansas in volts so all of those issues will be addressed in the environmental document also comments about the ventilation structure locations and we do have four locations on Stockton Avenue in West San Jose area that you know their comments about which one might be fake and why in terms of project impacts lots of comments about traffic and circulation certainly during construction we're looking at a project that has about eight years of construction maybe about five years of intense construction and so there's issues about traffic detour routes how we're going to address circulation and get people where they need to get to during construction particularly for the downtown San Jose station parking loss a lot of comments about parking loss during during construction around the Deardon station you know there's a number of parking lots just south of Santa Clara Street you know what's going to happen with those that's a big construction staging area that's absolutely needed for the deer density noise and vibration impacts certainly construction activities of this magnitude generate substantial noise effects during construction we have a lot of mitigation measures identified the document to try and reduce those impacts both noise and vibration I think there's maybe almost plenty just in the noise section trying to reduce that impact we also have mitigation measures to reduce long term operation ground borne noise which also an issue tunneling under properties people are concerned about us tunneling under the properties you know how what what impact is that going to have them how you know how do how is that accomplished and then lots of comments about twin bore you know some people prefer to course on people for her single bore so lots of comments about how that's going to be accomplished and what are the environmental document does address a large number of topics and this is just kind of a list of the topics they were addressed in the document and these are topics that we had no adverse or significant impact after mitigation that doesn't mean we didn't address impacts there's hundreds of mitigation measures in this document this document is you know thousand pages long and you'll see hundreds of mitigation measures trying to address a variety impacts in terms our quality dust control on and on and on so when we say there's no adverse impacts it's only after these mitigation measures are implemented but a lot of those mitigation measures deal with construction impacts just because that's a major construction activity at a number of locations has some operation impacts and these are long-term impacts that we need to also mitigate the traffic impacts at Santa Clara station all relate to the transit-oriented joint development because when you do joint development you introduce traffic and people are driving back and forth so there's a number of intersections or locations where we have to mitigate traffic impacts firms operations we do have what's called isolated slab track and that basically means the track is put on a concrete pad our concrete construction effort and underneath that concrete pad there's going to be essentially hard rubber support for it so that when the Bart vehicles go over that track there's a little cushion and it flexes a little bit as it goes over and that's how you control ground board noise it's very expensive but we've identified the need for isolated slab track and this is where the Bart vehicles will be going under residential locations not all the residential locations but some locations where were maybe at a curve or were shallower in depth and that's where we need to this isolated slab track to reduce those X to an acceptable level now the mitigation monitoring and reporting program if anyone's been involved with phase one phase once had an extremely complicated and aggressive mitigation reporting plan we actually report our progress on mitigation measures quarterly to the FTA we're tracking these mitigation measures all the time and so these mitigation major measures are absolutely implemented tracked and reported on our progress some of this certainly will involve a lot of coordination with the the toothy we have been enhancing our discussion of the construction outreach and management program in the final we did have a lot of comments about you know how are we going to ensure that these outreach necessary let the public know what's going on how are we going to minimize transportation impacts etc and so we've actually beefed up that quite a bit and when you see the final environmental document you'll see comments you'll see comments about that responses on that you'll actually see in the final document we do strike out and edits in the document so you'll be able to see but where we've changed the document from the draft we do have certainly some adverse and significant unavoidable impacts after mitigation you know we can't all those impacts to acceptable levels certainly construction is the big issue locations dealing with transportation is this huge issue downtown certainly with the twin bore tunneling methodology construction activities because downtown corrupting a a stretch of Street on Santa Clara will be impacting certainly traffic will be impacting us bus transit lines the light rail system if it's the west option so there's a lot of impacts that we can't really ensure that we're going to reduce optical levels to work we're disclosing the fact that you know that's it's not great we're gonna do whatever we can but it's it's have some impacts construction related air quality impacts this really doesn't relate to any one location it's the cumulative fact from doing construction activities that a number of locations so you don't have to be concerned that there's going to be an air quality impacted you know one location it's just spread out and when you add all of that up it does exceed the threshold that the Bay Area Air Quality Management District is established noise we'd certainly like to be doing construction downtown that's that's at an acceptable level but we really can't ensure that we have to deal with a contractor and we've got major construction activities going on so we'll do the best we can in that area so economics this is it's into a federal environmental current requirement and that's trying to ensure that we do not we allow access to people to business it around the downtown area certainly don't relate it to the transit-oriented joint development we have similar impacts with traffic air quality and greenhouse gas emissions and oddly enough you get to the greenhouse gas emissions because the state trying to aggressively reduce greenhouse gas emissions over time and when you start enter aid adding residential and commercial developments you can't absolutely ensure that they'll have zero impact on greenhouse gas emissions the next steps you know where you are going to be we've been frank we've been addressing these environmental comments you know since March takes a long time to address 860 comments all those comments everyone who commented will see their comment and the response in the final environmental document we will be identifying the options that will be included Berlin mentioned we really need to get to that point where we have a recommended project and options that we conclude and we our target is to release the document by the end of the year one of the things is that we are participating in this project for the Federal Transit Administration so as we get comfortable with all the responses I also need to submit those responses to the Federal Transit Administration for there but right now our target is to submit an administrative final to FTA the end of next week and then it's their job to look and see how our responses are and if they think they are adequate for their needs so it's kind of a two-step process VT has to be comfortable and then ft has to be comfortable and we can't release the final until both agencies Carolyn mentioned some of the scheduled activities here you know we hope to work towards getting to the VTA Board of Directors meeting on 4th for certified the certifying the final environmental impact report and also they'd have to you approve a project at that time once we do that then Bart board plans to take an action on the environmental document they're going to operate the system so they have their participating to in the record decision in March and as we've heard several times today that's just a critical date to achieve okay and we're at one of these checkpoints any questions clarifying questions I'm sure that me Ricardo would councilmember pyrolysis and thought about this and it keeps them up at night in direction all at a time that things are about to really pop in downtown San Jose all the high-rise construction and all the excitement that's happening I'm not really sure who the question is for but it's just sort of going through my through my mind of how does that all work with sort of perhaps informing full of what of what is going to be coming and how do you sort of combine again all the new construction with the construction that's happening here with all of the course the homes and businesses that already exists right is that for a question yeah we've tried to as I said we tried to enhance the discussions of how our outreach program is going to work and so there are discussions in there about there's a bullet item about coordinating with the city of high speed rail you know other other activities that are going on you know we really try it we're gonna really trying to let every people everyone know what's going on all the time it's a little hard to anticipate who might be doing construction at one point at time versus another point of time it's a challenge yeah so one of the things is to coordinate closely with the city and others who are doing doing construction I mean it is and we'll just go through it later about just how long the construction timeframe is say for the downtown San Jose station and we'll go over that under the tunneling methodologies and you know we don't know all the projects or don't come in to San Jose lot of projects are hoping part comes in to San Jose so it can't wait and then build part when they're done because they want us to be there so that serving their residents or their customers or their workers so I you know it's just gonna be a lot of coordination and understanding or five years projects could come in and begin construction then we won't even know about them because we're already in construction want to just continue to coordinate as for the Deardon area we are coordinating heavily right now with Google and Cal train and high-speed rail there's a lot of coordination right there that's going to have to take place for that so it's just going to be a matter of coordinating those activities and getting the communications out as much as we can we cannot be reactive we're gonna have to be proactive and how we do our outreach and we need to have people understand how they can voice their concerns or their questions and continuously answer them and we'll be I mean we will have a fairly substantially large outreach team on this I mean these projects that are being done in LA we've been visiting Los Angeles other other areas where they're having a number of downtown construction subway tunnels constructed they have large integrated could reach teams that we're really learning from as well as Phoenix had one with Valley Metro and learning from those bodies how they constantly coordinate in terms of moving a project that takes five years to construct Korea you know you have a pretty lean staff doing all the work that you're currently doing bagent how much more work to be done not just the community outreach but all of the engineers and traffic map I mean you can just go on you're obviously planning budget and your hiring process all the people that you're going to need along the way that's an excellent question and I have full faith and confidence in my staff but also recognize that there's no bandwidth there to take on something of this magnitude and that's one of the reasons why we're hiring a program manager to help us with this we've gone through that process currently negotiating with a firm and we also will be you know there will be contractors that will come on board and those contractors will also have community contract individuals so that we can fully coordinate as Carolyn described this effort it's going to be like no other we have seen it's not just one building going up on one plot of land in downtown San Jose we're talking about five miles of underground construction but with a lot of surface activity and then about a mile in Santa Clara with above grade construction activity for a period of five plus years so there will be extensive communication we're going to communication communicate early and often and there will be we currently have community working groups for each of the areas where there's a station there's a community working group that has been engaged for the past two years and those efforts will continue those will be our voices and our contact but in addition to that we're overlaying an outreach mechanism plus we will also have a a project office in downtown so that the community can come in be informed where we'll be providing updates it's going to be a very different than what we have done in the past given all of our lessons that we have learned from different levels of construction activity that have been performed in the past five years I believe that you will be pleased with the plan and we just have to put that plan in motion and tweak it as we learn more thank you chair and thank you Ken for highlighting that the challenge that is that is to come certainly something that I'll be working closely with our mayor on in regards to making sure that we are working closely together with the community with VTA and attempting to really tackle for the next several years the the impacts that are going to be there within the core downtown I think you know for highlighting the the idea of this project office downtown because I know that that's what came out of the bus rapid transit on just down the street right and it was really important for the community there to not have to go through hoops to to be able to have some direct contact with VTA staff and so I think that's gonna be key and I know I didn't see that was actually a couple of comments I was gonna raise and one of them can you actually brought out which was just kind of coordinating with all the momentum and everything that we have going on downtown all the rest of the development there's got to be a lot of coordination between our city staff VTA so I don't even know if it would be just a potentially a VTA project office downtown but something that was even coordinated amongst city staff in my office because of the just a magnitude of what is going on there rather than just have it be a an input place for how Bart is going but to get updates one well what about the rest of the development that's happening around here two of the things so that I didn't hear one was on the impacts and the mitigations to our historic district that we have down there in right there where the station in fact will be the old formally Bank of Italy Bank of America building that that potential building there and just that the historic nature of that district as well so I didn't see anything presented there in that regard I know the socio economics kind of touches a little bit but not it just wasn't really highlighted and for me that's a that's a key factor as well and then the other is the particular area that we're looking at for weather even if it's the east or west station that particular area is full of small businesses you know it's it's not going to be what we what we're fortunate I think to have at the moment that dear Don which is potentially one major business right that we can we can coordinate with this is going to be more like it was with bus rapid transit on East Santa Clara where you know we're talking people that are speaking different languages we're talking with people that maybe have not really been engaged through the process just because they're you know they're not as in touch so that medication is well and I know that as I said you touched on the project office I think that's going to be key because some of these individuals even as much as we we're trying to engage them and keep them informed they're sort of you know on hold some of these businesses is well turned over and so I think that that's just going to be another challenge that we have to keep in mind but those two areas so those are my comments thank you Tom fitzwater to speak on a historic district and as soon as I just say a few words regarding the businesses and and you're absolutely correct one of the things that we're going to be doing is we're going to be putting together this business outreach and working very closely with the Downtown Association and others we'll come back to you all with a specific approach it's still in the in formation today but in recognition that not only the business but the property owners because what happens is that we may talk to the business what the business may turn over property owners are not aware of what's going to be impacting their future potentially seize the source so therefore the the the strategy is going to be much more comprehensive than we've had in the past given the areas that we're going to be impacting and we want to make sure that the the businesses that are there and the opportunity for businesses there continues to thrive and we not have an experience of circa 28 years ago or so when we severely impacted small businesses medium and large in downtown San Jose with the construction of the light rail this with regard to you're concerned about historic district my staff has been working with staff from the Historic Landmarks Commission on this issue and we've met with them and I think right now there's a scheduled presentation for that Commission I don't know I forgot an exact date but I know there's a scheduled meeting to discuss the potential impacts that would occur since this is a federal document we also have to deal with the State Historic Preservation Office in Sacramento and so we have to submit to them a number of environmental documents dealing with historic structures how we're gonna protect might impact them and make sure that the State Historic Preservation Office feels that it's an acceptable level of impact so we've had to deal with that and we had made we actually have made changes because of anticipating the need to have an acceptable project to that agency thank you so a couple of questions so one being that my understanding is that the boring would probably begin from the Santa Clara and city of Santa Clara and and that would be going in and there would be extractions of you know soil or whatever so there's I take it you do talk a little bit about how the environmental document would address the impacts are or whatever all has to be removed for them you know how because it'll leave through the my city and you know my residents right right the environmental document does talk about all the muck that would be removed from the tunnel-boring machine and so fortunately we have a pretty large area there at the Newhall maintenance facility that we can use until that's developed as a maintenance facility but we do talk about the document does identify number of truck trips that are anticipated to remove that muck and it also talks about the traffic haul routes it should be used so we're trying to be consistent with San Jose and Santa Clara's haul routes to get those trucks to the freeway as quick as possible so they don't impact traffic so the impacts are as minimal as possible I think I'd have to refresh my mind but it you know takes a little bit of time to load a truck so there can't be you know a whole fleet of trucks leaving at once it's a little bit you know staggered so when you talked about also the options and you know the options that you've presented at this point in the environmental document so if there were to have happen to happen to be in require a change say it either dirt on station or even what we're talking about with Santa Clara and and you acknowledge some of the the comments from the community would if something happened where those you know the options change does the environmental document have to be gotten you have to go back to addressed if something happens with the station alignment or the where stations are or elimination you know is that create a different option that has to be full right and if you see you know you saw the list of historical environmental doctors that we prepared so in 2007 we did a supplemental e ir and that was to just address refinements to the project that the design team came up with and they said this is this would be a better approach so okay now that approach has its own environmental impacts maybe they're less than the other but if they have their own environmental packs they need to be addressed so it's probably likely we'll be doing a supplemental at some point thank you thank you my question has to do with the air quality you touched briefly on it and you said Backman has some criteria so do we exceed that I mean to mitigate those and how do we do outreach to the residents socio-economic outreach is slightly different from the air quality outreach right it has to do with I think nitrous oxides and so the Bay Area Air Quality Management District has a threshold that says I think I'm correct on this it's something like 54 pounds per day and the problem is when we have potentially six construction sites going on at once when you add that all up we exceed 54 not at any one location but when it's a cumulative number and so we have to treat that as a as a number and so it does exceed the federal hurts that the Bay Area chordoma Air Quality Management District threshold and the particulate matter particulate matter the Bay Area Air Quality Management District has a number of mitigation measures that if you implement then not considered a significant impact and so we are committing to implementing I know maybe a dozen mitigation measures trying to reduce reduce that and that includes you know wetting down dirt areas during so there's not dust and particulates circulating the reason I ask is in my city via a huge construction I don't know exactly what you're talking about and outreach is really important so thank you Balewa Hidayah who's the project the planning manager for the project it will be going over actually a little more in detail about what the options are that are under consideration good morning so I'm gonna walk through we've got this graphic up here which is really simply the options that we're considering the critical options and the items that we discussed that we're going to be bringing to the board on October 5th tunneling technology single and doing board we've been analyzing this for quite a while and we'll be presenting a staff recommendation on September 22nd downtown San Jose station options east option west option which I'll explain a little bit in more detail and then dear Don stationed south option and north option so first I'll walk to the station options and then what we would like to get from you is actually input on the criteria we're going to be using to evaluate those options all the site plans are configured with the same sort of elements and I'll walk through each of those and just this is just for reference first we'll start with Allan rock 28th Street Station the top portion of the figure you see is single bore and the bottom portion is to embark and what we have here is the red dashed area let me orient you first on the right hand of the screen is East Santa Clara Street on the bottom is 28th Street and then on the left hand is East Julian the top portion is really where 101 Expressway is so the dashed red line is the construction staging area this is the area we'll be constructing the project over a period of five years and the tan area you see his transit oriented development and public facilities which once we finished constructing the project will build transit oriented joint development yellow box is the station platform below and again this is an underground station and then the orange that you see is the system's facility East option was added into this environmental document and we've been evaluating it over the course the last two years the top portion again all of these are structured the same way single bore and the bottom is to one bore again I'll orient you this is on East Santa Clara Street and you can see City Hall on that figure and this station option would be really primarily in front of San Jose City Hall it's between second and seventh Street if you notice on the bottom portion of the twin more the station yellow box is longer and that's because we have to build a crossover a crossover is where the trains turn back to optimize operations and maintenance and so that's that station box is longer and that's the location of the cut and cover which Carolyn and Krishna described a little more in the tunneling this is the west option downtown we've been setting this for many years it's been in previous environmental documents again on Santa Clara it is on the left hand side is Market Street and it it ends around 3rd Street this option and the reason why we added the east option we want to evaluate is when we started the planning effort again our general manager asked us to ensure that we were looking at options that did not impact existing infrastructure and we currently are operating light rail on 1st and 2nd and so that's why we included the East option as part of our analysis and VTA owns the the block the VTA block which will be our primary construction staging area in the downtown Deardon station option as I mentioned is one of the Deardon areas one of the areas we added an option the South option is the optional we've been studying for many years and again si P centers at the top of the screen in Santa Clara and on the left-hand side of the screen is the Cal train 'dear don historic station and we got in the same footprint it's a construction staging area in red - Lions joint development once we finish the construction of the area and the station is below the stations about 65 feet below for the two more configuration and the system's facilities is an orange you will notice that we have on all of these site plans we have the red arrows and those are proposed station locations those will be designed and looked at further once we make a selection of the options we are not those are just conceptual right now the north option is the one we added for this environmental document and again Santa Clara it really fronts Santa Clara it does not dissect the development site and we are evaluated this and studied this further in this environmental document and this is one of the decisions we'll be making on October 5th if Carolyn mentioned we have an end of the line maintenance facility and this is the santa clara station the reason why you only see one figure here is because it's at grade at this point we're out of the tunnel configuration and again the station is really you enter low grade and the station platform is at grade and we'll have the same facilities at this location transit-oriented joint development and assistance facility and we'll be using all of the Newhall yard as a construction staging area so I'll stop here for any questions on the site plans you know I'm gonna throw my two questions out first while everyone else is thinking about their questions so the first thing Lela thank you very much could you kind of go back because as we talk about the construction methodology and all there's this thing in terms of what requires cut and cover and what doesn't so could you highlight for us the cut and cover and then the other one is it was mentioned earlier if I understood correctly that there some of these require at least temporary movement or disabling some of our light rail tracks and sewing having to do some sort of bridge or something again could you just kind of go through these and tell us where those those impacts are or highlight those for us focus maybe on the downtown and it's all this the yellow areas are really defined as the key station areas but let me let me walk through that that's a great question so the West option you asked about cut and cover which is a great question and we get all the time the question we've been receiving lately is oh we heard that you're cutting covering all of Santa Clara Street and let me reassure you that's not what we're doing in or we will have to cut and cover the station areas and again there'll be more of this discussion Carolyn and Krishna will talk about it but that yellow box area is where we'll have to cut and cover on the bottom figure so for the 24 we do not have to cut you cover for single the top box station platform is within the tunnel inside the tunnel so we do not have to do a cut and cover construction for that and cut and cover construction is really excavating down to build the station box in essence so that that that's the station location so on all these figures that you see the yellow box for the twin bore is really the conqueror we do not have the extent of cutting cover obviously for the single bore okay so so the bottom line is that yellow does not represent cut and cover that yellow only represents station but when you're looking at the twin bore station and cut and cover are one in the same right correct right so one of the things and we'll go back to the downtown West option just to let you know so I'm not sure on the single board the stations are the station entrances would be constructed off street and then you would enter into the tunnel section which actually would include the platform that's the difference in a single border twin gory art you have you build a platform between the two tunnels primarily it over it so you do a big cotton cover box and the tunnel and and the tracks run through that area so it's a different kind of construction your and so your station entrances are smaller usually off the side street for a cut for a single bore you'll have a larger station entrance but primarily it's off street it's not on the street so you have a larger area less area that you impact in terms of a cotton cover lumpy cover will just be building a station entrance and then have a light rail can you I wasn't sure where that gets disrupted so for the west option we would have to for a portion of time have a bus bridge it's on first and second obviously and in that location we'd have to sequence the construction for a period of time that would impact and we evaluate that in the environmental document but again that's only for twin board not for singles so for single you're not cutting cover so we do not impact the light rail and then if you could Alum Rock FL sitting if young land that we currently do not own the land but we would be purchasing the land and that's correct so we're off street yeah so again but it's still the same thing dangerous in terms of cut and cover absolutely all of the stations over 24 there's cut and cover for single there is not at the station areas except for the station entrance which and they can be do the same thing with Dara dawn because there's more going on at Dara ton I mean yeah and and the reason why I brought up the entrances is because there is a lot going on at Deer Don and we really need to make some critical decisions that dear Don so we can inform our design for the entrances but again the same concept applies the area we'd be purchasing is to construct for about five to six years and then we'd have to sequence activity and coordination with all the development and everything that's planned to occur in that area so that's why we have to start coordinating very closely with the developer great okay and then I'm going to turn to dr. Hendrix thank you um just to follow on this question about cutting cover I would like to make a suggestion about the graphics you use I'm themed to be able to separate so that you both at what is cut and cover versus not using ello for the station ever not cut and cover that's gonna become if we don't clarify the graphics of this this is going to be confusing for everybody for the day that's a great suggestion thank you this is great what you talked about I didn't see like a pro and con art that's coming that's coming next and I will hold my questions about that on that but one thing as it relates to the deer we're about how the art station will connect I'm not quite sure I see from the graphics here of how either one of these actually connect into so many of you are where we're working actively VTA's leading an effort and working actively with the city of San Jose Kaltura and high-speed rail and actually Google and looking at this area for a larger facility that would house all of this new transportation that's going to be coming into the area so we're really excited about that once we define that footprint we are looking then we will design the entrances optimally for close connection and so you can envision that over the Cal train tracks right now you would have a larger facility and then we would have to integrate within that facility and we're looking right now at really the highest priority connections so not everything could be right next to each other but which ones are the best transfer points and how do people get to the different locations so we're still working through that and we can refine that as we advance design kind of a policy perspective the the policy direction is there will be obsessed appropriate connection to make it facilitate that between the different office the policy direction right and I think with all the transportation the billions of dollars that's coming in to deer down we we have to be looking at that yeah right work like you're diamonds of that show the entrance talk to me so that might change what is kind of the policy or vision around how we're making the decision what what are the kind of factors that go into that says it's better here or versus there versus whatever not this specific that kind of the policy vision so let me just I'm gonna cover some criteria that we're gonna use and makes in future slices right sure yeah but but I do want to mention we still have some work to do once we define the project we are going to be going through an access planning transit-oriented development study we are going to be spending two years really refining and making sure that our access points to the stations are really we look at it from a multi-modal perspective that's really critical obviously and so we'll be doing that analysis to refine the entrances but I can share with you in the next couple of slides the criteria we will use to decide the option so you talked about pros and cons and I can sort of talk about what we're gonna bring to the board in September September 22nd which will really lay out how we've evaluated so I guess just found myself there so I should just look at it there will be access points of this and the decisioning around access points we shouldn't get hung up in that decision thought about it now that's a future thing to do it's just more yes you will be able to access what we did learn with the with the first face even though you're not doing underground station is that we were able to move the project for cuz we knew where the platform was the integral parts of the BART infrastructure but we really took some more time and read InDesign they access around each of those stations how the transit centers were laid out how the bicycle facilities all that that was down we were able to take a little more time and do that because the construction was contractors moving forward and I think we finished the access planning maybe a year or so later and those were separate contracts and they were designed bid build we work closely with the cities so those are things that can still sort of happen we have to know where the portals are gonna be and that'll be a key how are they getting into the station's but how we access them how we develop around at what that will look like we have a little bit more time it's these key decisions on the construction of the tunnel and this where the stations are going to be their apps critical moving that forward and that seemed to work out well because it gave us a little more time to work with the cities and with the communities about how we would do that that'll be good for you guys to make sure you clarify with us what are these creeks the critical decisions we have to deal with now and not get hung up in some of the future decisions because there's just more input than have before we get to those thank you thank you before before I call on next person um we've been asked while our mics and mower are doing fairly well in terms of for the people in the room because we're webcasting can I ask Ford members to please pull the mic up get close may sound loud to you but we need it for the webcasting okay and so director Davis you're next thank you just picking up on the director Andrews comments I appreciate the conversation about Deardon station and given that it seems like Bart is moving faster than some of the other projects how how are you guys planning to kind of build flexibility into the EEI are so that if things change down the road we don't have to do supplemental and hold up everything because there are a lot of decisions that haven't been made at Jared on yet and we want one like this to stay on track yeah flexibility so I would just focus on the red dashed area as our environmental envelope that's the most critical so we have environment cleared that whole area and so working within that area we have no issue with it won't be an issue and so we've really created flexibility and we learned that from phase one and phase one we sort of defined everything really really rigidly and then what happened was it kept on having to reevaluate so in this document we made sure we had a broader envelope to work in and I think we've covered that for a deer though so thank you I appreciate that so given the the red dashed lines does it include or I can't tell from this does it include the station right now the station itself because if there's a possibility or a need for connecting with the other transit options do we need to make sure that that building is part of the the footprint yeah that's that's a great question we're that's one of the reasons why we're coordinating so heavily with our other partners because the high speed rail has a footprint for a station that's over the Cal train tracks in that sort of purplish area you see the large area we've identified it as a transit facility which gives us some flexibilities so that connection can be made so it's really coordinating our environmental documents okay thank you well I just wanted to to say thank you as well for some of my colleagues for pointing out that I don't think it is as clear [Music] thank you [Laughter] see it's not clear as I think it could be and even last night I think there was even a potentially a better document that I that I saw that was presented to the Downtown Association that showed a little even slightly different color mapping of the cut and cover I do think that is important I am very familiar with it but even simple things like denoting the light rail tracks not necessarily everybody is as familiar with where those are at even though it seems like it's common but that's not the case and so knowing that on the the twin board like the twin board picture here for downtown West it's not very clear that where the impact might be with having to do a bus bridge for for light rail and and maybe even a different color because as our chair pointed out you know in one sense on the on the twin board the entire yellow is both a station and a cut and cover so just I think to make it a little bit more obvious on what it is that we're talking about with the to give the two different methodologies great feedback we you know living and breathing these figures so any but from all of you it's really appreciated what will revise those so they get presented at the next presentation and in the document I'm afraid so um a couple things that I just wanted to say first of all this is really amazing amount of work that's already gone into this so thank you for getting us this far I do want to reinforce the point that dev just raised about that envelope I was nervous even as we began the e IR that the envelopes weren't big enough and frankly didn't um acknowledge where we may see opportunities that being said I have two requests that I want to make mostly for VTA just as we think more broadly about how we have the conversation with the community one is that when we look at the dirt on station in particular and we're talking about it even if we're talking about it related to Bart all the massive connections that are going to go in we we almost need to figure out a way to continue to as we express what the envelope is all of the different partners that we're going to be working with because when you look at this and you think okay high-speed rail Bart I thought it was interesting that folks forgot our light rail you know not us we didn't forget it others that we we really are acknowledging all the integrations including the airport because if as VTA is thinking about mobility is kind of our broadest goal that the one thing that we know we're going to be running into is how we're going to make connections to the airport the ingress and egress for buses and I think the ingress and egress for buses not only for our buses but even our partner organizations like Greyhound and others that that require us to think in in in some ways in a more multi-dimensional way to express the the amount of interaction that's going to be happening at this station because for a couple of reasons I think one it'll help the public give us better input on what they see I think the other is that mobility becomes really critical and then the point you raised which I think is so important Leila about there's so many access points that it's easy to sort of start to say oh my gosh you know like how are we going to connect all this but your point about how we prioritize that I think it will be clear to people if people understand the inputs as and they'll be able to give us better feedback about what that what that will look like thank you payerl acardo thank you I appreciate all the points have been made by my colleagues I just wanted to ask about mm-hmm we if we go the single bore option and we're able to do that what I observed was that there's typically a vertical bore as well where exactly is that vertical bore as we look both at the downtown West option and at that deer down option the vertical bore would be on the VTA block okay so if you see those two arrows but actually three arrows right above the station platform below it's in that location that's right on Mitchell block not in the right away great and we would have a secondary entrance we have two entrances for the single bore in the downtown and that would be further down right and then as you go to deer Don was that look deer don't again we're we're sort of operating with the idea that we have not designed to fully designed to write all of us yet so we're have some flexibility but for the south option it would be we'd have two interests of entrances so we bore down and we would have to have because SAV Center and all the volume of writer ship that's going to be in this area we will have to do some level of cut and cover to add a lot basically a concourse and so but the arrows are really generally where we think we'll be doing the vertical or okay great there's a lot of flexibility as as we work through this with what's happening with Google high-speed rail dear Don it those are the one of things that we are going to have to make some decisions on that it doesn't have to be as part of the environmental document right now but it does have as long as worth in the envelope but we are gonna have to make those decisions within the next six like nine months by next June we would need to know I know obviously as you know this is a area of very high water table are we planning to permanently pump or we hoping be able to put the bathtub in there without it popping out I'm sorry to get all technical on you yeah there's gonna be there's gonna be a new fountain in your office construction we will have pumping stations popping out water from from the from the cotton cover box okay and then for the duration I mean is this gonna be a case of Pernod pumping as we yes yes along the alignment if you'll see it's instead an abundant profiles that's part of environmental documents you have the points where you have some and and in some part of that so we will be continuously pumping you know of course on L whenever the water fills up in those sums will be pumped out okay is there any distinction in terms of hydraulics whether we go to single or twin bores exact is it make it any easier for us for it single war yes when it comes to twin bore you have 33 cross passages you have multiple points where you where you piers the the tunnel liner so the chances of leakages is more when it comes to single the the points value going to the tunnel is only where do you access the station platforms there's fewer points of entry yes thank you pretty convincing thank you okay so so just gonna summarize so I guess what I'm hearing is if to help us because you guys as you said you live and breathe this we get it periodically we have to kind of reset our brain so if if on these we can add more clearly pop out we're tracks are involved in terms of any any of the tracks whether it's on you know in the downtown with the light rail and maybe also looking at whether we need to do a Jared on and then also if you can clearly delineate what is truly cut and cover so you know if stations are one color that's fine but what's the cut and cover area and then also where the the bore I mean they're still like they're still a little maybe there with a boring they're still kind of a little teeny cut and cover but where those things are so if we could delineate that so we can make sure we understand that and then also if you could answer one which is you showed in terms of with the West station you said that the bore down is in that VTA block can you look at the looking at the East one could you help us understand where it is there is it in the same place there's we're closing two entrances for the east and again this has not been designed to fully so this is just a concept little drawing but it would be on that on that beige hand box in that location on sixth Street and then also in city of San Jose Plaza so that you would be boring down pouring down okay yeah if we can look at how to absolutely into any and and one of the reasons why we've got those two locations as I mentioned there's a block historic district in this area so we're sort of limited of more we can go down okay great madam chair I just want to make sure that we are clear when we start talking about vertical bores there is a shaft that will be built at the VTA block for the bores that Lela just referred to or to build the entrances so that's not the shaft where we're going to be okay I think we have one more question director Jones yes I'm the single versus twin bore all right what I'd like to see is part of the analysis is also variants like writer comfort just just the technical aspects but also how you know and the other thing too is when you give us the pros and cons not just a laundry list of pros and cons but also from the case perspective which are the higher priorities ok so are we good to first okay dr. cart stations will all be green can you also show us or demonstrate for us how we think people will get to the stations and what those kinds of increased bike and where we expect it to come from I imagine that will be analyzed it is analyzed in the environmental document and I should mention it's a good question at Alan rock we will have parking so we're looking at as sort of a parking right location that people would come to with a car note there will be no dedicated parking for the art project in downtown because we anticipate that people use other different modes to get there and then at deira don because there's such a large consolidated effort going on we're coordinating all of that stuff so we really think it's strongly that with all of the transportation investment that people should be coming there besides just just driving right so that's gonna be really important as we plan and then at Santa Clara we will have some level of parking in that location but all of our sites we're looking at is from a real shared parking perspective we are bringing transit here from a doing a regional connection to try to make sure that people are using transit and coming they're not driving if at all possible but we also know the realities and we are going to be able to provide some level parking at some locations if I think about coming out of South County be great if I can ride Cal train up and drive yes yes so we able to demonstrate for me basically how you know which exits I'll be using how I'll be moving back and forth and what those demands will be like now on the freeway at those points so on so on the environmental impacts we do have what what we think the drive share will be coming in to those stations so there's an event environmental analysis as Tom mentioned we look at all those activities and then we actually then mitigate what we can now grant in time will go on and we'll be able to find out exactly what's going to happen the one thing here and we never really stop planning this until we're almost ready to put it into passenger service um so there's gonna be a lot of planning activities and I think that's one of the things that a that we need to do is just let people know that there's going to be more opportunities for more more input into how this gets done and you know we don't exactly know where the exact station the garage entrances will be how we design the garage with the station will depend on what's selected and and as we move into engineering so a lot of these activities will continue on and and we will try to keep we will keep the board more posted on how we're going to be doing that the outreach that we'll be doing for those activities okay thank you now we're going to go ahead and continue on that was a good strategic point for that question slide hey so an environmental evaluation criteria so as staff we take the options and we use a set of qualitative and quantitative criteria and we do an assessment we've done this process for many years on all of our environmental documents for our capital projects and this helps us inform our recommendation to the board we'll be doing that over the course we've already begun that process we'll be doing that course in the next couple of weeks what we would really appreciate getting is input on the criteria because that helps form how we evaluate so I'll be presenting some of that in your memo that you received we shared the criteria but there's a little more detail in this presentation and then we'll be coming back to you on September 22nd to present that analysis and walk through it I've already heard the user experience was one item that was brought up and I think that's great input we will add that to the criteria as we start evaluating so let me walk through the criteria a little bit the criteria for the stations is we have two sets of criteria one for the station location and then one for the tunneling because obviously there's some different criteria we have to look at for the station locations we're going to be looking at construct construction impacts and let me just add that we're really working heavily with the city staff city of San Jose and Santa Clara staff so this criteria has been actually vetted and we've received input from them so the construction impacts impacts the existing infrastructure as I mentioned on the less option will be impacting light rail impacts to businesses and then utilities connectivity is incredibly important for station locations what our is it connecting to other modes connection connections to activity centers long-term economic development what's how is this the entrances or the stations compatible with the launch city's long-range plan location of transit oriented development and then ridership is really critical and important we'll be looking at cost order of magnitude right of it right away if we have availability if it's an impact to historic resources so we evaluate that in this and then the alignment are we do we have the optimal horizontal and vertical alignment now for tunneling we have a different set of criteria a little bit similar and again as I got great input that will add the user experience as part of this criteria constructibility complexity of the effort that we're going to be taking environmental impacts during construction and to historic resources systems operations which is really critical as we mentioned Bart is our partner and they're going to be operating and maintaining the the line down to San Jose Santa Clara and then long-term economic development and costs so those are the criteria that we'll be using to help inform the staff recommendation that we will be bringing back to you on September 20 second so at this point I'd open it up to really get feedback from the board so that we could do our evaluation over the next couple of weeks okay so let me take a pause and say where we are so this is basically we're trying to wrap up item three point two so as Leila just said if we could right now if the board could look at these criteria and any other comments you have in terms of other criteria you would like staff to consider and we still have another agenda item with a quite a few slides which is really going into the double bore versus single bore and the comparative analysis and so I don't want to cut that short so what I'm going to ask is that we just go down the line if you have any other ideas in terms of criteria you would like to have considered if we can get them out there not for the purpose of having a give and take if staff if you can note those down if you need clarification ask for it otherwise let's just make sure we all hear the additional ideas in terms of criteria so I'm gonna go from my left and so going mr. Nunez if you have anything okay so we're just gonna kind of go around the room on this okay so and again if everyone can speak directly into your mics okay under long-term economic development does that include things like you know in some subway stations that I've visited have like little coffee shops in the tunnels and things like that it's that considered as part of this is that like for example of double board doesn't give you enough space to have I don't know a newspaper stand is that being considered is it's hard to drill down once you've already drilled once so we're not evaluating that level of detail and as Carolyn said we're going to be planning on the decision making process obviously we're going to be having to work with our partners at Bart's to figure out the lessons learned they have about their stations and how they operate them and activate activating those areas so this is more integrating with the future of the city and the economic development surrounding it but I do I think transitory and joint development could you know we can take a look at first incident station entrance into a twin boy versus a station entrance that we would have off-site might allow for more development or more economic or some businesses that can be in that area you can take a look at that as part of that as well I'd love to see if Bart can actually make money leasing some space potentially then that's my that's my the goal of the question that I'm posing dr. O'Neill thank you so the only comment I would make think that's a great list in it kind of to build on some comments that have already been made about user experience would be you know the quality of life issues which we're facing and also like we talked about the economic development and particularly for me as I look at like Santa Clara University and where they're looking I'm looking what are the impacts on long term Community Development and some of the ideas and thoughts who might have about you know how Bart could positively or negatively and I think positively impact the role that Santa Clara University can play in the larger community so I would look at that community at you know long-term development kinda called out in some of these bullets but I wanted to say it explicitly that we're looking at they're separating how we look at things from what is construct ability from the long term running of the service I mean you already said here this is a five year to build and we're gonna run it for 50-plus so we need to make sure we focus on which of the aspects in the Krait in the decision-making about how we go and I would think we'd want to make sure we're going for how it's gonna long-term operate over the distance you know I already made my comment on what I'd like to see so I was looking for a timeline overlay which I haven't seen so far you know if you're bringing it up further in the five-year period which portions will be impacted first you have a staging and a construction a staging in a construction it's not that the entire area is going to be impacted at the same time for the in all the five years yeah that's to come some of that level we know but we're going to be bringing on obviously as we advance design we're going to be looking at the delivery method how do we build this project how's the sequins work how do we get in and get out so those things will be will have more information by the September and so the next well in the environmental documents does it does give some timeframes for for construction the next presentation will actually talk about the twin bore and how that would how that would work in terms of the actual impacts to the street that's more most of the focus than something that's an impact that's off street so thank you I'm not sure the operations of a station is an issue as far as the location but certainly we here in the BART stations but other stations that are deeply underground anywhere of the elevator not working or the escalator not working particular escalators when you know I think of DC and how and how far it is and whether that's an issue that comes up in location but how the how the station is going to operate I said a question for a counsel Rob no these are all very good suggestions but I know what we're trying to do is create an environmental document here that's gonna withstand legal challenge and I know that their secret defines what exactly is or is not an after criteria that we should study are we creating more problems for ourselves by expanding criteria beyond scope sequa I don't believe so I think we're just making giving direction of staff as to what should be considered but I both of these options are being considered in the environmental document which one they choose I think is a decision of the board both are being analyzed for their environmental impact so we should be fine so and so any different environmental sections or the different areas there is actually environmental impact criteria how we measure an impact and those we are consistent for the environmental document okay so we're evaluating how we'll choose between options which okay got it so we're not varying in terms of what we're got it okay that's perfect the only thing I just emphasize you know there are three bullets to describe construction impacts there's a lot packed in it particularly that second bullet around impacts of businesses institutions and key destinations I would just want to know that we are clearly differentiating impacts to you know those businesses that have a great flexibility like say a Deloitte major employer that has employees that may or not even work downtown that even though they're stationed there as opposed to a small restaurant that's gonna be severely impact impacted by whether or not someone can get into that front door I just want to make sure we're really bearing down on that distinction looking at the criteria that you have I think it would be helpful to me at least to get some idea of what's kind of a hard constraint because what is kind of flexible what we know to be factual with some degree of certainty and what we're kind of speculating on too so can I can wrap my head round but to give different weights to the consideration for instance ridership that's kind of to me it I think that's kind of a guesstimate at best right but then we have hard things that we can't overcome in terms of environmental constraints or construction impacts they're just things like that so we know where wiggle room is also I think in terms of the city's long term planning phase 2 will affect San Jose and Santa Clara I think would be good for the board to have some sense of what the vision of the long-term economic development of both cities are so we as we decide as a board how we will be impacting those two cities we know what the cities want continue down the road I was just gonna add that that I'm very interested in understanding the opportunities for placemaking along the alignment and we cover that in some other areas but I really am talking about what makes a better community space not just an economic space because I think sometimes they're overlapped and sometimes they aren't and then the second issue that I think we just have to lay out is around safety and that's both safety of the choice and I think we have to do a careful examination of that for example relative to Horace Mann School so there's safety in terms of operations in addition to safety in terms of construction hey um before I open it up to public comments again in this if you go back to where we started this presentation what when we what comes before us October 5th when we make a decision there are a couple of forks in the road and so again one is around the tunneling technology another one regarding station locations such as the downtown the East versus the West the Dehradun the North versus South etc so when we were talking about the criteria think about the criteria that as decision makers that we're gonna want to understand as we pick those options again this is an iterative process here so there's what we're trying to do is get this officially on books you know this whole March okay versus all the other decisions that have to made down the road as we actually do this true design and such so if you have this is not your one and only opportunity if you have other ideas after you walk out of here and you go back and think what's gonna be important for me to understand choosing a single board versus a double bar at East versus West etc if that information through the board secretary's office so that it gets to the team so it's not a one and only opportunity now with that what I'd like to do is we do have some public speakers on this item and so I'd like to we have four public speakers if you can keep your comments to two minutes I'd appreciate that we have Chloe very Darren ja John just rollin LeBron and David the era and if you can just line up and we'll take you in whatever order just identify yourself when you come up to the microphone hello all my name is Chloe berry and I'm from the San Jose Downtown Association I want to thank the board for the opportunity to speak I'm really happy to hear many of you are already thinking along the same lines that we are considering the momentum of downtown the development that we have coming and and what this really looks like and what the the level of collaboration is necessary for all of us in the room and that you're thinking of our downtown historic district a nationally registered Historic District not just the Bank of Italy building but many of our smaller scale buildings along Santa Clara and adjacent streets and really what what is our core is advocating for our members and we come from a large scale transit project some of you may be remember when we started when light rail came through downtown in the late 80s but we're really looking at our small businesses along the Santa Clara corridor and what those impacts are to them many of them are immigrant owned businesses many of them have heard a lot about Bart over the years and and it's not really real until it's here so having a strong construction coordination between all parties is really going to be key for us and we're happy to hear that staff is already planning to have that increase as we move forward with this project and we're happy that Bart is finally coming to downtown San Jose and is going to be what we need to see this momentum go forward thank you hi my name is Darren Jost I'm the owner of the Roasterie outlet in downtown San Jose basically in the shadow of City Hall so seen quite a few of you guys in my store appreciate that very much thank you for hosting the workshop always good to get an opportunity to speak we at the store are very excited to have Bart come to downtown me personally I can't wait to to see it and actually use it I'm here today to express my support as a small business owner and lifelong San Jose resident for the West option looking at all the variables that have already been mentioned the environmental clearances the ownership of the mitchell block the existing city plans for higher density housing more towards the west option and the proximity to light rail i think that one thing that hasn't really been mentioned today was that there's a big value in being able to step off light rail and walk half of walk to Bart versus having to walk four or five blocks or even three blocks having the proximity will definitely increase ridership I think for both systems you know Scott nice made a comment last night at the downtown business association about you know just go west and I can't say it any easier than that my primary reason though and it kind of got glossed over on the different slides is the east option would actually put my store out of business or one of three grocery stores in all of downtown we're the only one that is looking more towards are more value more for the lower-income customer and the current projections or the current maps for or the east option actually show all the staging and construction done at our site yeah thank you I will have one more speaker on here sorry and that's Howard Miller thank you so two quick comments the first one that really surprised me is what to do is a sports and some are we going to truck them and out really that doesn't jive we've got full Union Pacific trucks day soon as we going to get the fifth it's a very simple you just basically that stuff goes away by rail and then the question is what you do with it in London we actually created a 1500 acre you know artificial island in the history of the of the Thames River and what we could probably do here is basically take all this stuff by rail to Alviso and probably do some mitigation for all the you know issues that we have got a day now the other thing and I'll come back with this in more details the next item is this premise somehow that we know mandates captain cover and that is absolutely false an issue here has to do with station construction and how it's done and on the next item I can I'm gonna show you how we build a station the size of an aircraft carrier right next to Europe's busiest shopping centre which is access for each was a million visitors a week without anybody noticing that anything happened so leave that float day enough thank you good morning chair Bruins and board members my name is David Viera earlier this year the city of San Jose Department of Transportation won a grant to do a multimodal transportation study around the 28th Street little Portugal BART station and I was wondering how VTA will or if VTA will and how will VTA if so participate with the city of San Jose in that multimodal transportation study around the 28th Street little Portugal station and yes I am lobbying for the name little Portugal as that station name in case you were wondering thank you and you know it will have a staff member get back to you mr. Vieira I was going to speak on the next item but I think my comments were probably more relevant to this one first you know I looked around the world to figure out what would be the most equivalent project to what we're doing and you guys are probably all seen it I'm going with the London Underground project the Crossrail project and the project has one advantage with the public which PBS did a whole show on that project and they address the issues of the historic buildings they address the district's their tunnels twice as long its twenty foot four same boring technology it'll seem very familiar when you look at our twin tunnel project but if people haven't seen it that's the October 2016 it's on PBS you can google it you can also google Crossrail I think the Wikipedia page covers a lot of the issues with businesses and other social impacts with all the links so it's a good primer for a project that would be very similar to ours and it took them ten years and I know we can get it done in less on the criteria I have a couple of concerns just looking at some of the projects I've been at dear Don stationed 20 times a year for the last ten years and we drive there to get there there's no other convenient way for my city I I worry about the expansive staging areas I worry about some of the you know cutting cover and the impacts that we'll have in the areas and I worry about the usability the ultimate solutions I have no answer I have no recommendation because that's what you guys are all set up to do but I just want to say the impacts of building this system are going to be huge shutting down light rail for 18 months and putting a bus bridge it seems like a huge problem shutting down dear Don Station effectively by eliminating everything around it seems like a problem so I don't know how the construction plans work out to really mitigate those but it's a big project as the important project I look forward to it being done but boy make choices that minimize some of those impacts and check out the video and let the public know because it really matches what we're doing great thank you thank you all your speakers for your patience and giving us nation here now we're gonna take us to item 3.3 which is to discuss the steps to the tunnel methodology decision again so what's going to happen here is we're going this is where we're going to get into the two different tunneling methodologies we're going to go through the the twin bore double bore first okay we're stop for questions if you can keep your questions to the double bore okay then we're gonna go to the single bore and at that point questions about the single bore and then whatever questions that come as a result of hearing both both of these methodologies okay so take it away staff Carolyn and Krishna yes so I'm just gonna give a little bit of the history so their person actually did a great job in explaining a little bit about how we're gonna do this presentation right now and let's just give a little bit of the engineering history because this is a shift since we're looking at a different tunneling methodology we originally in 20 2001 we execute the agreement with Bart we moved into the conceptual engineering phase that was when we had gotten into the the New Starts program with with the federal government and we did that phase for the full 16 miles between 2002 to 2004 we just continued into the 65% engineering phase which is 2004 to 2008 so most cases maybe not the stations were pretty much at 65% Christian can talk a little bit but that the tunneling section for twin bore was at a higher level to the level that we had already pretty much designed the tunnel boring machine and the tunnel liners and what we wanted and we're ready for procurement potentially of those um but what we started to look at is is that we well we ended up doing was as I mentioned earlier was phasing the implementation so we sort of put this side on hold so there's been this next six miles on hold so I just want to have a update from there on from 2008 and on what actually has been happening and why we're taking another look at another tunneling methodology so I'm going to turn over to Krishna Dhabi he's been really sort of the engineering program manager in terms of supporting this effort in in this phase of project development thanks Carolyn good morning board members um since 2008 since the time we finished our designs we we put the face to design on hold there have been quite a few changes I'll list them we have to consider them before restarting engineering activities for the last six months of the extension number one codes and standards have evolved the United States Geological Survey has new information concerning the Silver Creek Fault and this information may impact the designs that we have completed and Carolyn just mentioned we finish up to 95% engineering so we will have to reopen that to check to see if the new information will impact those designs that we had completed number two but facilities facilities standards have been updated number three we have made changes to the alignment to reflect development along the alignment number four as obvious as we mentioned before multiple times the tunneling technology has evolved so the industry has successfully implemented large bore tunnels around the world so in 2014 we renewed efforts with the construction of the first 10 miles underway with renewed efforts for planning for Phase two planning efforts included exploration of alternatives and our objective was to minimize disruption to the downtown area including existing underground utilities that are pretty old in that area the next slide here here is a photograph of a tunnel boring machine the machine here to the left excavate circular tunnels through a variety of strata and on the right is the general arrangement of a tunnel boring machine the white screw conveyor moves the muck that starts cut by the cutter head and then you have a belt conveyor behind the the screw conveyor that that moves the muck for disposal and again this is a general arrangement next slide you have a typical cross-section of of a single Bowl you see the platforms the platforms are stacked this is a picture from Barcelona it's the only underground transit system with station within within the tunnel because there are a lot of large tunnels built around the world but they are there for different applications and then the bottom is a typical twin board this is what Bart has and this is what we had designed to earlier I'll give you a brief overview on that twin board configuration you have you have two tunnels running in parallel there are approximately 20 20 feet in diameter they run side by side and they will be built we have the tunnel boring machine so construction of cross passages cross passages have needed in the event there's an emergency for patrons to move from the tunnel that's where the event is to the town at safer construction of cross passages especially in the soft ground that we have in San Jose is a challenge tom typically needs to be treated to stabilize the soil before breaking the tunnel liner and mining the tunnel cross passages are lined and you have fire resistant doors on either side of the cross passage so this is a picture of a cross passage under construction so I talked about soft ground I talked about a ground improvements here are some of the pictures I think this from Los Angeles Metro the top left is where you see that machine that that's used for ground improvements and there are about 33 cross passages more than half of them or along the public right-of-way and during construction you will see traffic impacts to support the ground improvements another aspect to consider with pinball is utility relocation as has been discussed in the past today you will see extensive utilities that me to be that will need to be relocated if you go down this twin world path especially in the downtown area again these pictures are from Los Angeles crossover this is this is one of the this is one of the places where trains have switched from one truck to the other in the event of an emergency and this is constructed through cotton cover and this will be in the downtown area the crossover that we have is adjacent to the station and because of this the current cover box this location is about thousand four hundred feet going through very fast because I have less than an hour and I have about 50 fights to cover so here is an overview of the alignment what you see here is cotton cover construction at one to three locations where you have the stations and two locations where you will have the methanol ventilation shaft one at 13th Street and one along straw along stocks in the venue so uh the length of the coven color box for for a typical station is about 900 feet one at Allen rock and one when I did it on and for the downtown station as I mentioned before is over thousand four hundred feet these these cotton cover boxes they go as deep as 70 feet that's that's that's that's too if the following slides you will see is a sequence of construction the first step is to install a supportive excavation wall during this period traffic will be confined to one direction and this is the slurry wall that will be installed for for support of excavation wall yeah this is going to be in the downtown San Jose area and also the other areas other station areas so after completion of supportive excavation wall will be excavation for for soil for about 15-20 feet before the streets is cities decked and traffic is allowed back the few pictures from from Los Angeles I believe this is the Hollywood Boulevard and you see the extent of impact to the to the community to the neighborhood because of current cover construction so after the king is completed excavation continues below the below the decked roadway this is a this is a picture from again I believe Los Angeles where you see the street decked about and excavation continues yeah and and to the top you see utilities that are hung from from the from the road decks excavation continues with with internal bracings and if you see at the top of traffic flows on one side of the road so you're right you know is the deck deck Street with its traffic flowing and to your left you will see construction continues below the deck Street once the construction is complete once the completion of the station box cover this wall is back filth and the street is restored here is a quick overview of the constructional impacts due to construction of a cotton cover box this is a table that that's in the ER document the impacts are sometimes concurrent and sometimes not the sea winds of impacts will be established by the contractor you see what what starts off at the beginning is the advanced utility relocation the duration of construction is about 16 to 24 months that's that's followed by supportive excavation wall and there are some concurrent activities going on at during this period supportive excavation is from from 12 to 18 months and then you have making installation the station box excavation takes about a year to year and a half followed by tunnel boring machine removal that takes about 2 to 4 weeks and this time boring machine removal is based on an approach that was adopted during the 65% engineering phase this may or may not happen and this is this depends on the sequence that's the con that the contractor adopts here is a typical at winburn configuration the station is about 55 feet from the ground the platform is about 28 the the platform is over 28 feet wide it's a bit about 9 feet or 3 inches unobstructed and the station is built we are current cover method view of current conversation box summarize we have approximately 20 20 feet diameter tunnels the two two of them and each tunnel acting as in the trackway the stations are built by cotton cover method there are three underground stations and to methanol ventilation structures with one crossover there are 33 cross passages and this approach involves extensive utility relocation had the five current cover locations within the public right-of-way okay can turn on your lights if you if you want to ask the question because that way I can kind of keep an eye but mayoral Accardo your first thanks for the boring machine will look better than this but oh there it goes it's on great when when we're applying for the full funding grant agreement we know that I know this team has been working very hard with the FTA for many years to sort of line us up the last presidential election I know didn't help but as we assess our likelihood of securing the FFG a and as early around as possible there's our selection have any impact that is our selection this twin bore single or have any impact on how the FTA is going to view this project we've briefed the FTA we've gone up and done a briefing with them particularly when we were adding it to the environmental document so we have met with FTA and they were wanted us to include it in the in the document that was for sure and that we would continue to look at we haven't seen I think a really a lot of this comes down to the risk assessment and understanding that this has only been done in you know large tunnels are not really the issue in this ground it it's woodwork I think it's really making sure the things that are going to matter to them is have you done an appropriate risk assessment and what they feel that you've that's the right risk the other is your technical capability and capacity so do you have a team that can deliver this project those will be their two key criteria that's what they use on other projects and that is sort of one things we'll take a look at and then they're going to be interested in the in how we do our contract procurement and that we're getting somebody who can deliver the project they feel good well in his experience I think that would be the the areas if we do twin bore there's a lot of companies have done it they have a lot of experience but they also have had a lot of issues little construction in general and that's why they want to submit a lot of risk into that as well okay and you know I remember going to Seattle about a decade ago and we looked at their dirty video machine and got to crawl down in there and check it all out and I remember Jack I'm trying remember Jack's last name we thank you Collins yes I remember when he kept emphasizing with all the risk was in the cross passages that's where the risk is to the workers that's where the risk is for in terms of soil stability and cost of construction and all those things is that something we'll be able to emphasize particularly to our friends at Bart and FTA so maybe Dennis you want to answer that the process of applying for funding grant agreement all of the requisite risks associated with either option or examined their accumulated there's a statistical analysis that their likelihood and it's derived into a risk cost that needs to be included in the project budget there's also a risk time that needs to be included into the project schedule either option will go through that process in some way with regard to the cross passages as Krishna pointed out each one of them requires a penetration in each of the the parallel tunnels each of them will require some ground improvement from the surface principally which is drilling down and grouting jet grouting and doing the tunnels so that when you open the tunnel interface to the ground it's improved by grout each one of those creates a long-term risk of water intrusion which is not manifest in a single board they have different issues that the stations for the single board but really it that's something we'll be able to I hope persuasively a search should that is this panel decide that's the direction we're going I hope we can emphasize that to our friends at FTA I guess the last question was I know that the leadership apart is particularly concerned or expressed some concern about the capacity of small platforms for folks who may be waiting and I know that we have constraints and the frequency of Bart trains by virtue of what can get through or under the bay and so we don't have the luxury they might have in Barcelona running trains at such a frequency that we don't need a lot of waiting area have we had a very clear sense of sort of what the capacity will be in terms of waiting and that's one of the engineering analysis we are looking at different options I think Leila mentioned it earlier Krishna could speak to this little bit so for example it dear Don where you might have an event letting out which they haven't met many of theirs and that's why we're looking at a larger mezzanine waiting area internet cut and cover in that area which we could do for just the platform as for we are constrained with the twin bore and the width of the platforms just because we're going close building face to building face so we only have really the width of Santa Clara and even that might be intruding on some of the basements and the and the apt that as well as we can the engineering team so we'll be bringing on board we'll be doing that but it's just it is something that we are we're a little constrained in the downtown San Jose and the ability to where how where they were happening where people are held I guess until they get to a platform regardless of which option we're pretty constrained on platforms yeah but when it comes to did it on and island rock we have considered a concourse that especially for dilettante which could take the search and then you can manage people moving into those platforms thank you so some of these issues that mayor just raised are they going to be factored into this criteria and so when we're going to be making that decision when you'll start looking at the pros and cons are we gonna see like side by side in terms of some of these issues maybe I don't want to answer the question if we could it would be beneficial let me do it I think the operational considerations are definitely going to be considered okay [Music] director Hendricks though since it was a full funding agreement was mentioned I'll just ask I don't need precision but is there a significant difference between in the price and the cost of single bore versus the dual bore so from the analysis that we have seen so far I can tell you that the base cost appears to be lower for the single board but considering the fact that we have not developed the designs for single bore as extensively as we have for the twin board the uncertainties associated with the base cost is subject to you know addition of more contingencies so if you add uncertainties you will see the twin slightly expensive and cuts are e single slightly expensive and compared to 20 but these uncertainties go away potentially as you do more design okay thank you thank you so much so again posed and cons you talked about this assessment is that I'm assuming these are natural risks how about the man-made security risks do we have a pro and con between twin and single for the human factor for helping the people who are already in the platform evacuate safely well there is a single board twin board we have standards that we need to follow we can't compromise on them so both both both single and twin will be designed to those standards case in point is NFPA 130 which talks about you know we have to follow those guidelines and CPUC reviews and reason before approving construction Association and they will it was very clear direction because that's very important to me because to make that decision between single bore and double board that's a factor of consideration I'll cover part of that in a single board presentation but I can tell you this much that that the guidelines are there we have to prove that we meet those guidelines we use computer simulations to to prove and that's reviewed before we go into construction thank you I do have a I do have one with the spirit of trying to keep it just to the twin for in terms of you can go back to slide the ground improvement slide second about 63 when you know about ground improvement is this is this something unique to the double bore and is this really about ground stabilization maybe maybe a little description of what this really is solid stabilization is not just unique to twin bore we show that here because we have extensive current our we have cross passage construction so we will need to improve the the ground does not mean that in single Bowl we don't have cargo cover we do have but that is off street okay and then in terms of utility relocation so with twin bore clearly you have cut and cover which clearly now deals with utility heavy duty utility relocation but in terms of where you don't have the cut and cover where you're just boring underneath if there any more or less utility relocation just where the tunnel is again without the not the cut and cover no I don't believe so okay so it basically is equal at that at that point okay I and then one last one on what side 78 when you have the that table and talk about duration is this is this this cumulative across the entire project is this you know like when you have I'm trying to understand like when you have that cut and cover is this the impact at each of those stations those are just looking at the downtown yeah the table that you see that is for downtown because that's where you have extensive relocation of utilities okay so that's that's the major impact okay but all the other activities are are same for all the stations okay let's go ahead and move on to the single bore configuration before you start hang on a second so board members it's 20 till 12 we did kind of plan this for three hours so my concern is we're gonna go into a lot of things so I guess maybe can I get an understanding of our ability to go later what our tolerance is for going later anybody have to leave at 12 o'clock sharp okay we have a couple okay so we're gonna try and Krishna if you could do what you just did if you could move through the presentation somewhat quickly and then we'll see what we can do in terms of of the questions and such this slide is on the right is a picture from Barcelona Barcelona line 9 is the only transit system with station platform it's within the tunnel this configuration has two independent track base with one board with with within one board but separated by a wall or a slab since the platform's crossovers and cross passages are all within the tunnel there is minimal disruption to the neighborhood and most importantly there is minimal impacts to existing utilities he was the background on the single ball analysis that we have done so far a single board configuration was found to be feasible after a joint review with bat this was in 2015 for the technical analysis based on design criteria developed with Bart confirm the feasibility in this analysis the technical studies that we did in 2016 the tunnel diameter was established the alignment both horizontal and vertical developed to a conceptual level most importantly a ventilation system confirming two standard safety standards established by the National Fire Protection Association and applicable but standards was developed the tunnel and station configuration were reviewed for emergency egress the configuration developed met applicable national state and bod safety standards Oh a comparative analysis of the two tunneling options is underway the single board configuration developed for the bot extension has the trackway in three distinct arrangements side by side transition and stacked now first side by side con arrangement if you see here - to your to your right as as it as the alignment approaches South it's in it's in a side by side configuration and this is the configuration that Bart is very familiar with and you see the side by side configuration between stations and as the trains exit the the west portal the next is crossover at the crossover location again the tracks are in a side-by-side configuration again we we wanted to make sure that the crossover configuration is very similar to what Bart hack currently has that makes them very they will be familiar with the operation but in this configuration and we decided to keep it this way in our conceptions in our preliminary technical studies next we go on to talk configuration at station location if you see here the platform's are stacked and the platform's yeah the platforms are stacked at this location and between the stock configuration and I'll go back to the previous slide and the side-by-side configuration there is a suction that's in yellow where the trains where the guide the track weight transitions from being side by side to stacked here is a concept that we developed for the downtown station and if you see the station box to the right is is within the VTA block the the previously Mitchell block and this pattern cover construction houses fare gates the vertical circulation elements and the connection between the tunnel and the station box is via a circular guide way a circular what we call adits and one of the ways of doing this is through grant grant freezing and we will be exploring the small as we do and as we get into engineering now to summarize the single board configuration that was developed at the end of the technical studies we have 140 45 foot diameter tunnel but both track ways in the tunnel the cotton cover construction was confined to off suite station station entrances and the to material ventilation structures the there are three stations with stock platform within the tunnel and the tunnel has in it crossover and 76 cross passages utility relocation work is minimal only at the entrance locations a single Board of the technical study based on the study criteria developed with Bart shows the single board configuration is feasible it's safe and it is complying with applicable standards I'm gonna defer I'm gonna switch this up could you continue on because based on the questions that most of us have up here it really deals with a comparative stuff so if you can cover the comparative and then we'll do the questions okay just keep going to begin the comparative analysis the first step is to have a take a look at the the two configurations that we just saw to your left is the twin board to the right is the single ball the comparative analysis will evaluate cost schedule and performance of the two options the consultant aldia Services has met with Bart we had several work sessions with subject matter experts from various bad departments we interviewed the two engineering teams involved in the development of the two options the analysis team reviewed technical information they interviewed technical experts outside the project team they interviewed key stakeholders that included city of San Jose staff San Jose Fire Department and the California Public Utilities Commission they conducted several work sessions with engineers and subject matter experts for the development of a risk register Albia services is finalizing a draft record on the comparative assessment meetings are scheduled for next week including a meeting with Bart to review all the earth analysis all these findings are expected to be presented at the 9:22 workshop the next slide in July a team comprising of VTA but the city of San Jose State and few members in the VTA board visited Barcelona to study the metro line 9 system to learn from this the operators experience we covered the following topical areas design community impacts during construction operation and maintenance vertical circulation in emergency egress the stations there are far deeper when compared the configuration we have we have the look for the bad extension we were interested know to know how they manage those deep stations here are a few pictures from our Barcelona trip to the left what you see is is the platform on the you you have those sliding doors and to the right on that particular photo you have seating arrangements for passengers top right is a circular station entrance you have banks of high-speed elevators that serve the passengers can you go back one second I just want to make one comment on that just so that those that did not go to Barcelona that left slide those doors of screen doors that is not a truck that's not a train behind it that is the doors on the platform so the Train is on to the left of what those doors that you see ok so it which is different than what we're used to here with Bart so it's it's a safety feature but with or without the Train there the doors are closed when the train comes train doors and the screen the safety screen doors one thing about Barcelona to let you know is that it's automated so there's no driver in there in this vehicle on this extension of their lines so it's an automated system and the platform doors are there for safety and then the doors open and you can enter the track very similar zuv on certain airport people mover contact so yeah and yeah we did mention there they are much deeper in Barcelona the one where you see the high-speed elevator Bank that's the deepest station it was a hundred and eighty feet around 200 feet below ground we any of the members who did visit could also admit that the elevators were very high-speed I they probably got you up there within 10 10 15 seconds to the top it was amazing and not jolty so there actually was a very comfortable ride up to the top so it was a it was a interesting to where it's only been in operations for about 3 years 2 years 3 years so just to conclude on the steps to the tunnel telling methodology decision and one of them was as Krishna mentioned was a lot of the discussions on how we move forward and really looking at the single bore and making sure it's a viable option for you to consider here today or at the October board meeting so the first thing we did was do we have a is what's the analysis is single bore a potential then we went and did the technical studies based on concerns or I guess considerations we wanted to here primarily working with Bart we developed that scope of services heavily related to the size of the tunnel what would be the access and egress and emergency processes as well as ventilation so we did those studies as well and that was where we did some of the simulation that was talked about some of the analysis that we use using the and if BA 130 standards we did the tour of the Barcelona's 9 metro system really to touch it and take a look at it and understand how it worked really was useful and now we're doing the tunneling options comparative analysis which will be done and those results will be brought to you on September 22nd we continue to have dialogue with the city of San Jose and with Bart on these on the two method methodology so we're hope to bring you a well we're planning on bringing you a recommendation at least a draft staff recommendation at this september workshop with a final staff recommendation at the board meeting in october ok so we're going to open it up to questions but again I want to remind you that the comparative analysis is what's being done now that will be completed and brought to us at our next workshop and so that's when we will get down to that nitty-gritty in terms of looking at things more side-by-side ok so what I'm going to do is open it up to questions and director Hendricks you get to go first if I'm if I'm understanding everything was said and some of the questions that me Ricardo asked before he left it's I was originally thinking here is dual bore single bore and a single bore really a viable technology you're saying Singapore's used lots of different places around the world of this size it is for highway they have it locations for water so it's let me get to what it sounds like what the key part of this is is single bore with a platform and is the platform going to be large and area going to be large enough to handle the crowd and the facility and being able to mover is is that really what the question is is that trying to get the platform and the trains within the single bore I'm trying to understand well what's the issue for us is could we design it to meet all the applicable standards and and that includes the platform with and be able to - for emergency egress or - you know in terms of an emergency that is part of it but we're looking at wider platforms and we currently had designed in the twin bore is that correct in the yes so if you see the unobstructed width of the platform I just in all those lights but currently has about nine feet three inches unobstructed but but what we see in the in the single board is about 15 and a half feet and a lot of this also has to do with how much you're a transfer or you're carrying more than one line at this point we don't you know we won't be a transfer place where one line now could that change in the future maybe but at this point we're just one line and so we're not handling the transfer applications are a number of lines like you're seeing in downtown San Francisco or even in downtown Oakland where you're having two lines go through there we have one line two lines going through but not true they said in terms of what our current plans are is width of platform unobstructed with yes is wider in the single bore than the dual bore so even if you ran into those other questions here we're already planning for more space definitely in the downtown that's true let me add a little bit clarification on that so the when mayor la carta raised the issue when we were in Barcelona so a single bore we still are defining how wide that bore is and it's different it's not that it's not necessarily the exact same thing as in Barcelona okay so Barcelona when you physically we were there trying to look at some of us we're looking at predominantly at the user experience and such they happen with their choice in their design okay they chose narrower platforms we are in ours needing to meet Bart's standard and or exceed Bart standard and when you factor in whether we are moving just people which is what they're lying nine does or whether we also have that whole event thing where you have that sudden flood of people which becomes a safety issue so so I don't know that have any clarification to this and we have the to let you know one of the things during the ten websites was actually to size the board so we optimized it sort of based on the ridership as well so it gave us some flexibility we could go larger we didn't think we needed to because we could get more platform with with the 45-foot or tunnel so you know we have the ability the platform twin bore unless you go really deep like you're doing a single bore you're you're you're constrained by the width of the street and where the buildings are in the downtown directory Jaeger are there other systems that have their stations that that oh I'm just to see if I've ever ever been on them or what that experience would feel like for people yes there are quite a few stations even within the United States that have deeper platform Washington so that's about the same same level if not deeper they're deeper on and twenty 120 feet I suppose but the Embarcadero is their lowest the platform for Embarcadero is 65 feet for a barcode arrow so we would be so that would be where our top platform would be and then the next platform be just below that and I think if in DC well now if their stations see I have to do something so it doesn't feel perhaps says claustrophobic or as condensed when you're that far underground that you don't get sort of like panicky you know can I comment on that one that you can't there is something to comment on this one is because as I aged I feel like I'm getting more and more sensitive to tight tighter spaces and such so like when like children want to do spelunking I won't sign up for that so I went i went there with i didn't want to know anything about each of these stations i went in just as the user experience but because of the way the experience in barcelona it proved to me we can design these things you do not feel when you've taken an elevator down eight stories okay in like 15 seconds and you get down there you don't you don't feel you don't feel like you're a mole in under the ground it's it's that the design is very light and airy so to me it's it's it's it can be done and I felt I did not feel I could not have any different sense of when I was in the deepest point versus more closer to a surface station our stations would be just are we constrained with with space at all I think it all comes to the design of the system and that is you mean that's why you see sort of the one design looks very open in here we have this large station but that does allow air and light to come into the stations and you're able to it you kick it so I think it's just really going to come down to the design of it there are a lot we can actually send you the table that was in a presentation I think we've given it to other committees that actually has all the stations and sort of where they're held deep some of them are in the United States and around the world but we're not we're not pushing the envelope any other questions from from a issue of like getting federal funding or other sources of funding does having a single or double or twin wor you say effect the application at all because of maybe the avantgarde miss of a single bore or the potential dangers having only been done in one place in the world or in the converse where because we're trying something you know so spectacular there might be a reward for being bold and attracting more interest so I mean this was mentioned before by Leila when once we completed a feasibility study we shared our study with with FTA and we were open to questions from them and subsequent to that as we progress through the technical studies we did keep ifti involved in the process the current PMO even though is not they are not involved in phase 2 activities they are kept in the loop and we try to solace it advice information their expertise their their ideas because at the end of the day we will have to go back to them too once we do our risk assessment to have those assessments reviewed by them before we go into the FFG application phase so just the PMO is the project manager oversight team and so they review our they're out there on board with us there are partners and delivering any projects at the federal money and if there's one more question that might be a bit sensitive but my understanding right now is that high-speed rail says they're gonna go into San Jose either at great or above they don't want to do Underground's the city of San Jose is having independent people try to verify that that assertion because the community does want it possibly go underground I my understanding is if that happens hypothetically high-speed rail would go beneath the BART and so with the the for youth was a 55-foot performance platform depth versus a 66 and 85 depth in the hypothetical situation where it would work underground to have high speed rail go underneath part given San Jose's high water table does that 10 10 foot difference really impact the the potential outcome of that path from happening do you think I don't think so but our alignment has been established so if anything changes it's going to be high-speed that's going deeper all right thank you okay one other thing I did director did is we what we found in terms of language when we were in Barcelona is we talked about twin born and we talked about single bore when we say single bore on our trip we were talking about exactly what you saw here today the where we got into the barrier is in Barcelona they do have wide single bore what's different is they have the double bore they have one wide single bore with a two parallel tracks still with the same cut and cover type of stations on it and then this new this new one which is the single bore where the staff the tracks ultimately stacked so that your station is inside so so in terms of the big wide or other than just water and other roads and such it is also for similar thing in terms of metro lines yeah okay so what's the unique is just having the station in underneath it just clear ask a clarifying question what you just said you said single bore with the station inside is the station inside the single bore the platform thank you for that correction okay so now we have some public comments on this item before we move to three point three we have one public comment which is Roland LeBron Rowland are you there you are that was three point three so there was a comment on three point three and then we're to move to three point four so before getting to the meat of this I got some good news for you our projections right now is Dehradun is a thousand passengers a minute in and out all mode ok and no constraints downtown who is platformer with because we go but platformer understand declara and the other platform is one block away so you have no issues day not one but block one building but in closing I want to give you preview was gonna hit your inboxes over the weekend and I'm going to reduce you to young lady her name is Linda Miller you'll be happy to know she's better looking at me she started a career in the US Army course as an engineer she built rocket launching pad so NASA she graduated from West Point as a civil engineer and right now she's in Sydney working on the metro she's pal design and underground station excavation why bring up it because before going to Sydney Linda worked in London he build the largest underground station under the Smithfield meet quarter of a mile long it is big enough to hold the largest building in Europe which is a building in London closing the way she did this is the way all the stations did got down including Bond Street it's basically you start out these two buildings it's like you're building the foundation stupid five sort of storage teams just like you're building a bit a normal building and then the TV ends come in a bit of maintenance while there they axis and then afterwards you go back very very carefully and you start widening what a tibia that's how you build your platforms is a technique that was developed in London 20 years ago is though SEL sprayed concrete lining in my presentation you can see 30 minute clip videos of Linda explain to you exactly how that works how it's done how much it costs that station as a quarter of a mile long cost half a billion dollars thank you okay so now we're going to move on to three point four and has really focused in on a preview of what we're to expect on September 22nd and Carolyn I think you're gonna be the one speaking to this item so this kind of just set our expectations so this is information hey this will be fairly quick cuz I think we've mentioned this a number of times today so at the September 22nd board workshop we're gonna have the funnel final results of the tunneling options and the comparative analysis and then we will with that information we'll go through the draft recommended project description looking at sort of our value how staff came up with the evaluation is that we used and then giving I guess primarily that would be it for discussion among the board and questions so the comparative analysis will be the bulk of the meeting and then a real discussion between the station options madam chair but a procedural question so you you're looking for input from us from now until September 22nd sending you questions or we if you have something you want to have addressed or have a concern definitely forward it to Elaine and we'll take that I think I'm the only the the city of San Jose does plan on holding a study session after that workshop sometime Oh September 19th right before so we'll have some feedback from the city of San Jose as well because they'll be wanting to weigh in H thank you so so again if you have anything that is gonna be important for your decision-making process please community that so that they don't have to read our minds between now and the 22nd okay and so that takes us to announcements if they have any announcements because I have a couple of things nope okay so I'm between us and the drawer here so first before I start I just wanted to acknowledge Sonoma and Marin County is they today launched their passenger service for smart which is the Sonoma Marin area rail transit so our fellow transit people to the north of us actually now have a passenger rail system so we congratulate them September is gonna be a busy month for us again we have a tripleheader so again if it's not on your calendars please do so you got the September 7th board meeting at 5:30 in the Board of Supervisors chambers downtown we have our next workshop which is all focused on phase 2 which is September 22nd starting at 9:00 a.m. sharp and that's here in the auditorium and then we have the joint VTA BART joint meeting on Thursday September 28th and again assume 9:00 a.m. you'll get more detailed information as that unfolds and that when I do encourage as many of us to get there as possible staff is working on the agenda and for that joint BART VTA board meeting the office sent out a query if anybody has any ideas for agenda items for that joint meeting again please get those through the board secretary's office to us as we start trying to solidify the agenda for that September 28th meeting and that's it so our meeting is unless there's any questions our meeting is now adjourned thank you very much you apologue dissertation planning Mercy College.

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